Stop Firefighting: Why Better Systems Run Better Events | Epic Events by vFairs | Iain Morrison

Younas, CEO (00:01.453) Hello everyone and thank you for joining us for the Epic Events We vFairs podcast. Today I have a very special guest with me. His name is Iain Morrison.

Iain Morrison is the CEO and co-founder of the Imagination Collaborative, an Australian studio building photo realistic digital twins and pre-visualizing tools for major outdoor events, venues and stadiums. He also founded Behind the Stage, an online event leadership training program and community that teaches event professionals how to plan, lead, and deliver with better systems and less burnout. With over 35 years in the event industry, has led large scale outdoor concerts, festivals, touring shows, and public events.

Lain thank you for being on the podcast. Iain (00:46.486) My pleasure, Jonas. My pleasure.

Thank you for having me. Younas, CEO (00:50.217) lain, do you want to quickly walk us through just a bit of a background of what led you to this industry in Jordan? Iain (00:57.

824) Yeah, great. I started at a young age. was enrolled for the school play and they quickly decided that I probably should be behind the scenes and not on the stage. I was relegated to moving some props around and I really enjoyed it.

I loved it. And as I sort of went through my schooling years, I stayed as part of the stage crew at school. And a lot of the older kids were working in the industry already. they enrolled me to come and work with them.

And I started working on some big rock and roll shows. Pink Floyd, Billy Joel, a few Australian big stadium bands or arena bands, sorry. And I just loved it. I couldn't get away from it.

So I went and studied theater stage and production management at university. and have been part of the industry ever since. Younas, CEO (01:56.909) Perfect.

And you have spent 35 years doing all of this. And I was going through the stuff you say working hard doesn't fix a problem. When did you realize that the industry had a systems problem, not a hustle problem? Iain (02:11.

456) I think I realized pretty early in my career, the thing is I didn't really do much about it at that time. I didn't know what to do about it at the time. And for most of my career, I think we sort of, we tried to implement more and more systems and processes and we realized that the more systems and processes we implemented, the easier things got for us. never, nothing in this industry is ever going to be.

easy, easy. However, implementing systems and processes made the whole production process a lot easier. And this sort of came to light in a show we did in 2013. It was called Soundwave in Australia.

was a huge touring festival that traveled Australia, five cities over three weekends. And There were that year we had Metallica headlining Lincoln Park supporting on the second stage. had Blink 182, the offspring. So it was a big, touring show and we had around 80 trucks, trucks of backline, just band equipment on the road that would go from town to town with the show.

And then each city had their own production. And this year there was some flooding between Brisbane where the show was the night before. and Sydney where we were looking after. And two of the trucks went down the highway that was flooded and they had a blink one eight two and the offsprings and some paramour back line in it.

And we spent the entire day in control room with police and court trying to coordinate what we would do if these trucks didn't arrive because the bands were really clear that the show wouldn't go on without them. And. The whole day, my event manager and myself were in this control room trying to manage the situation. 35,000 people would have been displaced from a stage that we really had nowhere else at the festival to put them.

And the show ran itself without us there. And we realized at that point that the only reason it ran itself without the two key people from our side being involved was because we'd put the systems and processes in place. Iain (04:36.598) that it didn't rely on us being there.

Younas, CEO (04:39.815) And what are two to three systems that have the single biggest impact on whether an event runs smoothly or turns into a chaos? Iain (04:48.846) I talk a lot about decentralized command, which is the principle of, I just explained to you that you don't have to be there.

If you have to be as a manager at the event for the event to succeed, then you don't have the right systems and processes in place. It is a very uncomfortable theory for micro managers because they're like, no, no, I've got to be there. But the whole point is that you're there to make sure. that you're not a single point of failure, that your team can run it without you.

And this is a great principle called decentralized command. Another one I talk a lot about, and I think we're terrible in this industry, is leading up the chain of command. So learning how to manage people above us in decision-making and process situations, whether that's... the police in a control room or that's your client or maybe that's your boss you're going to a job interview for.

That decentralized command is, sorry, leading up the chain of command is really important process that I think a lot of people in this industry underestimate. And the next one is one called simplify, prioritize and execute. And sorry, simplify, prioritize and execute. that's very simple because you're overwhelmed by everything that's happening in an event.

And sometimes you just need to strip out the noise and just simplify the decisions you need to make, prioritize those decisions and then execute on them without trying to do everything at once. Just take it. You know, as they say, the only way to eat an elephant is one bite at a time. And that's really what this process does is it.

breaks it down to one little decision at a time. Younas, CEO (06:47.597) I like that. You described your approach as safe, then smart, then shiny.

How do you get clients and stakeholders to buy into that order when their legs are focused on just getting the shiny thing? Safe sounds boring. Everyone wants shiny. Iain (07:04.

833) Yeah, they do. And everyone wants that high rise building that looks beautiful and shiny, right? But where does that high rise building start? It starts by digging holes to lay foundations.

And foundations are no good unless you dig the holes. And the whole high rise building is no good if you don't put the foundations down. So you can't have that shiny high rise without making it safe and digging the holes. We call it ditch digging.

And it is the most boring, unappreciated work that nobody will ever see or recognize. Because once you've built the foundations, you've the ditches, you've built the foundations, then nobody's ever going to see that again. You're going to landscape over it. But without that work done in the first place, then that high rise building is no good to anyone.

Younas, CEO (08:04.845) You co-founded the Imagination Collaborative to build digital twins and visual planning tools. Tell us a bit more about it. Help us visualize what exactly this is all about.

Iain (08:18.412) Yeah, it goes back to the whole, being able to see problems before they happen, being able to put processes and systems in place that you stress test the event while it's still in its infancy. And you look at where the event's strong and where it needs improvement and how we can really get good return on investment. for people.

essentially what we do is we create 3D virtual worlds like a video game that you can walk around and explore and you can change costumes or as we call it signage or branding throughout the event. We can look at different sight lines for sponsor marquees or your hospitality suites, broadcasters. We show you exactly what that event is going to look like from every single angle before you commit budget, before you walk on site. And that's really important because it takes away a lot of those last minute surprises that you get with the traditional 2D floor plan where it's like, I didn't think it was going to look like that.

Well, here's exactly what, what it looks like. Even static renders don't show you. the depth and reality that the digital twins can show you. Younas, CEO (09:48.

621) And is this technology accessible to mid-sized teams or is it primarily something that's used for large scale big budget world? Iain (09:59.022) Look, we're doing more and more events all the time and it is accessible to people who have a good use case and can see how it will bring them return on investment. So if you're talking about bringing a 500,000 or even a 200 or $100,000 sponsor on board and that sponsors really wants to see exactly what they're getting, then this is a fairly small return on investment.

yeah, it just depends on the event and the use case as to, whether it's applicable to them. And we like to work with our clients to make sure it is, you know, they can see the benefits and the return on that investment they're putting in. Younas, CEO (10:44.973) Just going back, how do you design a schedule that actually respects people and why does that matter beyond just being decent to your crew?

Just want to understand having these clear rules and schedules that prevent fatigue. All of that sounds obvious, but many teams don't have them. Where exactly does it break down this whole thing? Iain (11:07.

886) I think the place a lot of people break down with their systems and processes is really by having single points of failure. and the event industry is renowned for this. run these massive events on the smell of an oily rag when it comes to people. And we don't implement the systems we need to ensure that one person isn't a single point of failure, that we build redundancy for people into the process.

mean, every event I've done for the last 15, 20 years has had redundancy on the main stage for power and for lighting systems and for audio systems. So there's no one single point of failure. If a generator goes down, there's another generator there that takes the load straight away and it doesn't miss a beat. The show continues.

With people, We don't do that. And we don't have those redundancy systems in place. So you end up with all these people just becoming the single point of failure. So if somebody is sick or they can't make the event for whatever reason, then the team struggles and somebody's got to put a heroic effort in to get it over the line.

Younas, CEO (12:31.565) Just as an attendee of all the events that you typically go ahead and join, which one is your favorite one and why? Why do you like that particular event and what makes that event a special event for you to attend? Iain (12:46.

606) As an attendee? Younas, CEO (12:48.525) As an attendee, yeah, just putting yourself more as an attendee. Do go ahead and attend some of the events.

Iain (12:52.526) I think the events that I really enjoy are the ones that take me on a journey that are immersive, are creative, they're engaging, they're not just a flat dimensional event. Really, you can tell they've spent time and passion putting their energy and creativity into. I think they're the best events.

Younas, CEO (13:28.013) And for you, when you attend these events, what is the main goal that you are trying to achieve? Are you more there for the content, for the learning piece? Are you there for the networking piece, which is trying to make more connections?

What do you think that in today's world people are more craving for when they are in the event itself? Is it learning or is it the networking? Iain (13:54.318) I think people are attending events a lot more for human connection and that's networking and that's being part of a community or whatever it is.

I think people are really wanting nowadays to get out and connect. And if I'm wrong, then why did events come back after COVID? Why are we not all just sitting in our Younas, CEO (14:00.718) Thank very much.

Iain (14:21.134) offices having virtual phone calls and virtual events. I think events came back after COVID because we long that human connection. We long that being as a community in a place together with sharing like-minded sharing our time with like-minded people.

And I think that's what will make events stronger in this age of AI as well. I think, you you really and compare where we're going in the next five years with what we went through with COVID. I think you'll get a lot of similarities in people just wanting connection and wanting to understand that what they're seeing is real and what they're feeling is real. And it's not some AI generated experience.

Younas, CEO (15:13.261) AI again has this promise that it would make a lot of people productive. Are you making use of AI in any way in your day-to-day work? And where do you see that AI has been able to provide you with some, I know, increase in productivity or decrease of cost, right?

Have you been able to see its impact within your work or your business? Iain (15:38.21) Yeah, absolutely. We, what we would call AI first.

So the first thing we do, how can we use AI to improve our systems and processes? know, we, we now we've used, Monday, which is like a sauna Monday that their project management software tools, we use AI to manage all of our Monday systems, boards, our to-do lists. we have AI, example, scan all of our risk processes and find failure points within our systems and processes. So being able to not take away and it's not doing the work for us.

It's not. And I think this is something a lot of people, very, they're jumping into AI and not thinking about, well, what happens if, something goes wrong. So you've got to remember that. If your event goes wrong, AI is not going to stand beside you and explain that to your client.

And it's not going to stand beside you in a court of law if somebody's injured or killed on an event site and be your co-accused. So the responsibility is still up to the human who's using the AI. But it is an incredible tool for finding all your failure points, for checking your schedules and making sure that everything that you've sort of got in the schedule is what is happening as per all the other event documentation. And it's, you know, we have an AI playbook, which I'm just sort of updating at the moment that goes through a lot of how we use AI in this manner.

to really improve the systems and processes in day-to-day work and still keep that human involvement because I think that's really, really important. And that's something that we risk over overexposing AI at too early a stage to just, well, it can write a schedule for me. I don't need to worry about it. And then you're standing on site with everything going horribly wrong and you haven't Iain (17:57.

57) given your expertise, your experience into that AI mix, you've just let it do its thing. And AI is all about human experience and being able to improve that and make your job. It should give, your job should be your highest and best use. And that is what AI empowers you to do.

It takes all that, that manual work away from you. Younas, CEO (18:28.893) Iain, if you could give one piece of advice to an event manager who's always in crisis mode, what would it be? Iain (18:38.

316) I think it would be implement systems and processes to be able to free yourself because I think a lot of people look at crisis mode as them being important, them being the key to an event. It can't run without me. But we need to stop celebrating people who push and are in crisis mode in this industry. And we need to start celebrating the people who put systems and processes in place that make events run seamlessly, have those points of redundancy we've talked about and really who improve, who lift the standard, because I think they're the people we need to really be recognizing as teams and organizations.

Younas, CEO (19:33.591) Yeah, 100%. I know it's easier said than done, but I absolutely agree with you. Many, many times, I know people within the customer base, within our own company, et cetera, where just being heroic, where someone is working 24-7 is something that's celebrated a lot more than just putting the right systems in place and having a normal life.

So I agree with you. Iain (19:55.854) I think it's very easy to do. know, it's, it's something we, we help people with on a day to day.

Now we do a lot of consulting. So we go into a lot of people's businesses and really help them to implement these systems and processes. And it's all a lot of the time it's right there in front of them. They just don't see it.

And that's really what we're helping. to do is just to put those systems and processes in place with them. And, you know, once you do that, it's like, my God, how did I not see this earlier? Younas, CEO (20:35.

167) I wish exactly. So for people who would want to connect with you, learn a bit more about you, what's the best way for them to reach out to you? Is it via a LinkedIn message or do you have an email address where they should reach out to? Iain (20:52.

066) Yeah, look, LinkedIn's great. me a DM on LinkedIn, Iain, I-A-I-N, Morrison. And yeah, you can find me behind the stage in Imagination Collaborative on LinkedIn, and we can go from there. Younas, CEO (21:06.

839) Perfect. Een, thank you so much for being on the podcast. Thank you everyone for dialing in and we'll see you in the next episode. Thank you, Een.

Iain (21:11.758) My pleasure. Thank you for having me.