Investing From Birth: How Families Can Build Wealth Together with Niall Dennehy

I don't mean to sound too, um, how should I put it, idealistic about things. And we are a for profit. We do want to create a company that is a generational defining company. But at the same time, it's a mission that everybody can relate to.

And what we found is with everything we're doing, it just resonates with everybody everywhere around the world that everybody wants to build wealth for themselves, their children. But we feel that the journeys that people go on, they're not aligned around the family and the individual. And again, yes, back to me, 4 kids, very generous family members and uncles, cousins. Really fortunate that I was at the tail end of a lot of their generosity.

But I figured why not make it easy for people to do it in a more digital native manner and also tell people learn about money to build financial literacy. Welcome to the Digital Irish Podcast, where innovation meets heritage and global impact is the name of the game. I'm Dave Byrne, your host on this journey through the stories of Irish innovators, entrepreneurs and creators who are having an incredible mark on the world stage. We are here to showcase the incredible talent that Irish visionaries bring to the world.

If you have been listening recently, I've been interviewing a lot of people about investing in start-ups and in Irish businesses. I'm going to change the direction slightly today by actually talking about investing in families and specifically children's future. So today's guest is Niall Dennehy, the CEO and cofounder of Nest defied. If you haven't heard of Testify, it is an AI powered platform that that's whole families wherever they are in the world invest together in a child's future.

So this is a wonderful story of Niall really thinking about life back in Ballydesmond and Kenny Cork when his mother walked him into a credit union for the first time. And how would that has ceded these idea of creating something using a I that enables families to really focus on investing in the kids? Because in today's world, that old school cash stuffed envelope that a grandparent may give you or a family member may give you just isn't as effective as it could be. So this Nesty really taps into the family WhatsApp chat or the grandparent in Dublin or a cousin in New York where they can invest in a child's investment accounts.

And we also talk through things like the tax reliefs that most Irish parents have never heard of and the actual impact of investing today in a child's future and what it could mean for them in 20 to 30 years. We also talk about Trump accounts in the US and Niles push for Ireland to copy that idea and what 1 to 2% fees quietly does over 30 years of compounding. So really fascinating conversation. Hopefully a little bit of inspiration for any parents out there, particularly new parents that want the best for their child's future.

And with that, I'll drop you straight in it. Firstly, Nial, thank you so much for taking out the time and joining us on the podcast. Thank you Dave, great to be here. Pleasure.

Big fan of the show and I love the work at Digital Irish are doing have done for a long time so really great to be here. I very much appreciate that. Firstly, let's start with the origin of Nastify. Because you've had a career that has spanned publishers, it has spanned fintech education.

How did all of these threads eventually come together to bring about an estefy? Yeah, it's an interesting one, Dave. It's multiple threads really coming together. A lot of it was sewn back in 1987 in a village in Gore called Ballydesmond.

Back then, my mother took me by the hand, walked me to a credit union, which was next door to our village in Ballydesmond. Incidentally, Dave, that credit union was named after a very famous woman and probably the most famous woman of all time in the history of the village of Ballydesmond. And her name is Nora Herlihy. And Nora Herlihy was a school teacher and one of the founding members of the credit union movement in Ireland, which around 7:00, the 5% of the population of Ireland, last time I checked, has an account with the credit union, like I still do.

And I get a statement every month from the credit union for that account that my mother Nora opened up for me back in 1987. Wow. But I was thinking back to that journey and having been taken next door, literally the credit union and our house growing up was about 10 metres away. She'd opened up an account for me.

I've got four children myself, aged 1710 and 13. And I was looking at their behaviours, thinking about what they were doing and looking at how relations oftentimes will send them toys. And we've got, you know, an Amazon box shows up in the doorstep here in Goatstown in Dublin where we live, or we get cash stuffed into an envelope for credit union, the confirmation, some form of a milestone event. And what often happens is the toys are not played with.

They're in some part given away or they are cycled. Cash then is inevitably spent. It's not saved. It's definitely not invested.

And when I looked at that market in Ireland and I looked at my situation and that there's got to be a better way for me as a parent and my wife to be able to save and invest on behalf of children. And I thought there's not a really good way for families to come together in a collaborative manner to be able to chip in or to make a contribution to a plan that's been set up on behalf of a child or in the name of a child. They thought with this really big transfer of wealth coming down the road, over the next 20 years in the US alone, it's going to be 84 trillion.

In Europe by 20-30, it's projected to be €3.5 trillion. And when they start to see here on the ground in Ireland, in Dublin even, and where we live, was that the banks and good bodies talked about all of this huge amount of money that's sitting on deposit overnight doing nothing. It's being eroded by inflation.

And that a large portion of the wealth that's being held in Ireland is by households that are effectively retired, who in some cases are subsidising their families. And I thought when you bring all of these things together, seeing it from my own point of view and looking at some of the technology that exists in the world today. And also because the focus and by financial institutions is oftentimes around the individual. In the age of AI, I believe you can have more meaningful, deeper relationships with families and you can involve the entire family in building a nest egg for the future of children's finances.

And the platform also enables an individual to build wealth. But to answer your question, Dave, I've gotten around it there in really roundabout way, personal problem. And what I found was rather than taking that short walk to the credit union, nowadays kids are being intercepted by applications like Revolute here in Europe, by Robin Hood, even by crypto com, and the institutions are struggling to not just retain but also to attain that next generation. So I thought, why the hell not build this?

Go after it ourselves. It's I, I love hearing stories where it's truly like a personal issue that you have where you're like, hey, like this isn't something that I'm just looking at as like, oh, I've done research and everything else. It's like I have a specific problem myself. I have a specific ask myself as a parent, I want to do this for my kids.

And I just love that entrepreneurial spirit of just going out and saying, do you know what? I'm just gonna build it myself. Like if nobody else will, I'm just gonna do it. Totally and when times get tough as they always do in a building anything, any venture trying to get from zero to 1, you really do need to think about the mission and the vision and get into people's hearts and brains and veins and get yourself excited about it get a team excited about it, get the world excited about it and to be able to shout about it and believe in it and to be convincing and to be all in on something.

To my mind, you have to start with the problem that you faced yourself or at least somebody within your network and you know, it's something that solves a problem that can make society a better place. I don't mean to sound too, um, how should I put it? Idealistic about things. And we are a for profit.

We do want to make a shit done of money. We do want to create a company that is a generational defining company. But at the same time, it's a mission that everybody can relate to. And what we found is with everything we're doing, it just resonates with everybody, everywhere around the world.

And everybody wants to build wealth for themselves, their children. But we feel that the journeys that people go on, they're not aligned around the family and the individual. And again, yes, back to me, 4 kids, very generous family members and uncles, cousins free. Fortunate that I was the, you know, the at the tail end of a lot of their generosity.

But I figured why not make it easy for people to do it in a more digital native manner And also to help people learn about money to build financial literacy, which is something that I'm shocked at the more I delve into it, how financially illiterate and non savvy people are. You can make an argument that financial institutions like banks, particularly in Ireland where we are, are happy for that to continue. But yes, it is a problem that I've faced and I figured as we go through these tough times, you've got to be building something that you're passionate about and that you want to solve.

And back to this Japanese principle of ikigai, which I'm probably but butchering right now. It's got to be something there's a market for that you can make a living from that you're passionate about, and that makes the world a better place. So yes, personal problem, but a huge opportunity. You brought up a great point about financial literacy, because I think if anybody goes out and speaks to family members, friends, like people that are very well educated, are doing very well in their careers, they often find themselves feeling like they that they're speaking a different language to the financial institutions and that there's things that they should be doing that they're not aware of.

Like that the financial world is just a kind of a black box to them a little bit. It sounds like that one of the things that Nastify is trying to do is almost demystify a little bit and simplify for families. So hypothetically, if there's a parent right now with no financial background listening to this, what does Nastify really help them do? A great question and this is really where AI does come into play and it really does make a massive impact.

And when I was doing my market research initially with the product validating, what do people really want to see? When I explained the concept to a few friends of mine who were entrepreneurs and they were quite savvy and they said this is such a great idea. Imagine for example, if you take Ireland, you know, which again is a small country, but we have this thing called a small gift exemption here right now and it's currently subject to change. But at 3K per parent per annum can gifted to children over a period of time.

So think about that from the parents alone, that's 6K per year over the course of an 18 year period, that's 108 K, which can be written off in the future against other forms of, you know, taxation. But a lot of people aren't aware of that at all. They've no idea that there is a thing called small gift exemption. They have no idea that there are accounts like a a bare trust account, which to my mind is not a great product over here.

And the thing about I is to use that other cliched word that people in Silicon Valley and tech like to say it democratises access to knowledge. It really does. And one of the things that we do with the app is we, um, we get people to on board through the institution, we get to know them, we get to see what their situation is. And it might be, for example, do you have children, yes or no?

If you do, did you know about the small gift exemption? If so, here's a projection that we make on, in the, on the fly projecting towards the future that with your four children, you can give this amount and by the age of 18, you'll have granted this. And it means that in the future you can do the following XYZ. And that information is not very complicated, but it is crap laptop to make it seem as if it's complicated.

But taking any good LLM and that can get to know you, that can persist information about you, your family, your situation, It really can unlock a huge amount of information that you may not already be familiar with. And what we've also found is when you look at institutions that are trusted, like your credit unions, like your community banks in the US, like people like on post or the, you know, the Postal Service in the UK, they've got this really deep and meaningful relationship with their customers.

But they oftentimes want to have the technology to be able to really tap into them and offer them products that they can make money from. They can bring value and everybody wins. But in terms of people being literate, oftentimes the institutions we found are happy for that to continue because they can oftentimes sell what are effectively, I'll give it, you know, direct here, but dog shit products that are wrapped up in things that people don't understand. And if you understood compounding, you will know that taking a 1% fees per annum over a period of time can be the difference depending on your starting point between hundreds of thousands of euro or dollar at the end of the day.

But people don't realise how much fees can add up to, they're unaware of the advantages that are on the table for them. And if you can then bring these different, uh, you know, products better and whip them into a nice cocktail, you can be in much better financial position overtime. But This is why getting to know an individual, being able to persist with memory and leveraging AI can really make a massive difference. And especially when you put that into the hands of an institution that already has the trust of the people.

We think it's an accelerant and it's like a lighting, you know, a fire under the, I guess the organization's capabilities to enable them to offer more products, better serve their customers. And if a customer feels like they're not being ripped off and they're being helped, they will do more business with the institution. And we're very much AB to B to C play where our target customers are credit unions, community banks, you know, postal services around the world to start out because that's where the trust is already.

But they are the institutions for struggling to educate the OR the their customers. But they've got a receptive base that they can easily reach, and with the eye right now, it's just a game changer. I'm also thinking of going back to your story about like your mother taking you down to the credit union. It's like in in years gone by, the relationship with with a credit union used to be a generational thing.

It's like I'm going to do my banking where my parents do their banking. It was very community feel to it. But obviously with the almost like the banking decentralisation with like a I with everything else, it's become such a more open playing field. And also as well, people are much more global than they ever were before where, you know, you have generations, people that would never walk into the bank down the road, but do banking online.

It does feel like that what you're creating is almost like a modern version of like recreating that community feel where it's like, hey, like although you're not maybe talking directly to a teller, there is going to be a system in place that knows you and is able then to respond directly to your needs. And the hope then as well, it sounds like, is that, hey, if you're able to do this as a parent for your kids, then these institutions will see that value of like, Oh, well, those kids will have a good experience and they'll come back and it can become a generational thing again.

You're totally right. And one of the things that I'm sure you've heard before is that, you know, it takes a village to raise a child. And one of the things, especially when it comes to Irish, uh, you know, people, everybody has got some connection abroad. I can think of, you know, my sister living in Dubai, I've got cousins in New York, I've got connections in Australia.

And now with technology, to your point about, you know, everybody becoming more globalised, I think you can help raise a child in a globalised village. And one of the things that I love about digital Irish and when I first met Virgil and the team there and I see what people do yourself included the events that you run and you're connecting the Irish diaspora together. That was part of the inspiration behind this in that I've seen first hand with my own family that people are living abroad.

They're asking how can we make a contribution to the child's, you know, future. Do you want me to send money to a bank account, send me the iband, send me your, you know, your routing number, etcetera. But the, the ability for somebody to, as we see it, tap on a link within a WhatsApp chat, a Telegram or an I message that the money then ends up in a custodial account that is sitting there in some form of an investment product opened for a child or for, you know, yourself if your parents want to donate to you as an adult, which does happen as well.

And a lot of adults are now being supported by their, by their, their elderly parents. That's the reality of the situation. So we're not putting a time limit on it. But yes, you are right.

The institutions, the relationships that people have with them and the footprint now of where people are much more nimble, agile, mobile, they can move abroad, they still take the same values with them. That was very much part of the thinking behind this. And when we put out one of her original explainer videos that you can see on YouTube, what you will see is there's a a money flow going from these different locations all back to somebody in Ireland. And that was again, thinking about my own family, my situation, cousins, aunts, uncles around the world and the relationship with an institution, but they may not have a relationship with the institution that the child is, you know, working with, to take that one example.

And we figured that as part of our proposition that we can help you maintain a relationship, not just with an individual, but we can also create connections with people who are currently part of the family unit but outside your financial organisation, and you can start to build a relationship with them. And if it starts with the child as the focal point of that journey, you're just giving that organisation, with the consent of the people involved, more opportunities to sell their products, but also to create meaningful connections and help everybody to win.

As you were talking there, I mean, you mentioned, you know, your own family, you've got nieces and nephews or around the world. And I almost had that as that image of the Irish grandmother at Christmas thinking of her grandchild in Australia that they're not going to see this Christmas. They want to provide for them. And it it sounds like that you're creating this opportunity of, hey, you may not be physically present, but your support can still be there for them.

100% think of it as almost being like a social network to connect up people financially and to help them build a relationship. And one of the things that we've been working on is the ability then for the person who makes a contribution with the consent of the family to be able to get updates and how they're, how they're, you know, they're progressing. And if you have take that grandmother, you know, living in a country abroad and they're quite generous and they have a high amount of disposable income back to this big intergenerational wealth transfer, they will in a lot of cases.

Want to give that to their grandkids, to their kids and the ability to see how this compounding, if it's in some form of like an investment product or savings pot. You know, it's we found is it's really rewarding for those people to be able to see the progress that is being made by the people that they have made a contribution towards. So that when they turn 18 and there's milestone or a life event that they want to go to college, further their education, maybe get married, etcetera, get a deposit for a car together, all of these different bonds was that people meet in life.

Sometimes the people who make a contribution along the way aren't always aware of the contribution they have made and they do it because they're totally selfless. But why not make it easier for them to get an updated about this and that they know their contribution has been meaningful. And that's why when you look at things in the long term and you make products available that enable investing and saving to happen and to put their money into a good product is really a meaningful way because there are knows anything about finance will know that you can in the US in particular, you can get ETFs and you're looking at a tiny, uh, you know, amount of fees if you manage it yourself.

But why not open people's eyes up to an ETF from a big player that is super low fees Don't go to an institution. Make that product available at the back end. And if you are then setting up, it could be a 529 college fund in the US or the 5:30 accounts, aka Trump accounts, which was part of the the inspiration behind this. If you know you're making a contribution and that money is going to work and do what it can and help you to reach these milestones and have an amazing journeys throughout your life.

It's just such a rewarding sensation for all involved to be part of that journey. I was actually. Just thinking of the Trump accounts because obviously for the folks who may be listening who are not in the US and not as familiar with Trump accounts, it's it's if. And now forgive me if I'm wrong here, it's $1000 seeded by the government for every child born between 20 and 25 and 2028.

And then there's up to $5000 a year in family contributions if I've got that right. So this does feel like it's right in Nestfield wheelhouse in regards to like, hey, if the, if a family wants to contribute 5000, then Nest 5 can provide the mechanisms for that. Have I got that right or? Totally, totally.

And we, yeah, we took some inspiration from that. Again, that journey, it was initially, well, the Invest America Act, uh, when went through Congress got passed, there were some phenomenal people involved in that. Uh, we're, we have spoke with the team behind that became known as the Trump against. And I believe 4547 is the number of the form that apparent uses to apply for, for all that entails.

And yeah, I think you're largely right. I believe it's up to 5K per annum. And then employers I believe can contribute up to 2 1/2 K parents can contribute a specific amount as well in that it's as I believe right now it's going to be capped initially. There are talks of expanding and the interesting thing we've seen in the US is that there are people like Michael and Susan Dell through their philanthropic foundation now are targeting kids in specific zip codes in the US who are maybe, uh, underprivileged And they are making, I believe, a top up, but also helping seed the accounts.

And you've got people like Ray Dalio, But think about it, If you, with the way the economy is developing globally, there unfortunately seems to be OK shaped economies. There's the haves, there's the have nots. There are a lot of people who feel that they're part of the the growth in society stock market equities and they're really profiting. But there are other people who may not have an ownership stake in companies at the stock market and all these different products out there.

But from birth, whether you like this product in the US or not, we believe there's a huge amount of merit to it and that the ability of getting people something from day one and letting compounding do its thing is a really worthwhile this thing for society to be invested in. And I would see overtime that that will be a predict huge success. And you will start to see, and I think SpaceX have talked about this already, but the idea of giving, you know, young people, babies, stock certificates to own some of the biggest companies in America over time, to have an ownership society from day one.

So that everybody, irrespective of your colour, your creed, where you were born and the lottery of life, what parents you were born to, rich, poor, middle class, everybody has got a chance and they've got, they have, they're all off to a good start. But I think it just sets a great tone for everybody included. And we are doing something here in Ireland with, uh, some people that we know and we're lobbying the government to be able to promote the same idea over here in Ireland with them, with the hope that the government will do the same in Ireland.

That's a. Fantastic to hear cause I, I do think that there is a lot of talk at the moment about the UK shaped economy and I'm, I'm actually gonna ask you to kind of explain, explain this in better detail than I will. But basically this is the halves accelerating away from the have nots like in regards to wealth. And it does feel like that what you know, as much as as much as there's no silver bullet, things like the investing in kids from a very young age and giving them ownership of their economy is 1 method to start starting to reverse that case shaped economy trend.

Have I got that right? Or like, am I kind of oversimplifying it a little too much? You're not. And one of the things that we put out on our website, Dave, just to illustrate how we can, you know, help avoid a severe case shaped economy over time is the park compounding.

And think about it. The figure that we put out there to make it meaningful was that if you were to start with an initial seed of let's say 2 1/2 thousand dollars at birth in an account. And if you were to make a collective monthly contribution from your aunts, your uncles, your grandparents, etcetera of 75 bucks a month. So that's which is not huge.

You can then end up at a situation whereby the age of 18 you could be sitting on you know 40 grand based on your total contributions of 18,700. By the age of 21, if the total contributions with you take that into account were $21,400, you could be sitting at 52,000 and 47. And by the age of 30, if you started with that 2 1/2 K seeded in an account top it up by $75.00 a month.

You will have $106,871 sitting in an account by the age of 18. And the assumption there is that would be based in a 7.3% average annual return compounded monthly overtime. So when you think of how the S&P 500 has performed, it's in line with that.

So that is just a hell of a way to start people so that when they are the age of 18, there is a society where you, I'm not saying you will have as much as the ultra wealthy, but you'll have something. Whereas the earlier you start, the better off you will be. And if that scheme is seated by government, by philanthropists, by your parents, by your extended circle, you can, you can see how powerful that is. And 106,000, even with inflation 18 years from now, gives you a lot of optionality where you're not ending up in student debt, you're not borrowing money, you're not, uh, you know, looking to go to loan sharks to put you through college, etcetera.

And taking on car loans that are 9 years to get a, an expensive car that you don't need, but it gives you options. So the earlier you start, the better. So that's why seeding and account we are very much in favour of. And as you're kind of lobbying the Irish government on this, are there many differences in Ireland and the US, like structural differences in how wealth is built and transferred that you need to take into consideration as you're having these conversations?

Yeah, we. We looked at this in detail and what we found is that in terms of the households in Europe compared to the US and in particular households in Ireland, I believe now I've got a cheque. Check me on this, Dave, but I think there's something like 2.2% of Irish households have some form of see some investment product.

I think the European Union is in and around 7 and in the US it's far higher. It's likely multiples of that. And you know, yourself living in the US, uh, words like 401K people are, have got brokerage accounts with Schwab, whatever. And the culture in the US is light years ahead of Europe and it's even further ahead of where things are in Ireland.

And oftentimes in Ireland, what we found is that a lot of the more traditional wealth managers have a hold or grip on the market. Literacy is super low. And oftentimes in the products that you're getting through wealth managers are again, their fees are very high. You people are unaware of the effect over time what the product will be.

We use those figures there of 2 1/2 K per 2 1/2 K seed, 75 per month. But you can end up doing, but if you were to add in one or two percent fees and that you're likely going to end up taking that headline figure we spoke about there by the age of 30, which was 100 and 6871. I think we looked at that. And if you were to pay 2% per annum, you've about I think close to 30,000 less at the end of the day.

So the fees didn't really add up their severe. So a lot of people are just unaware of that. So that's why starting at a young age, helping build financial literacy really does give people a head start. And when you combine that with the seed, but it's something that over here in Europe, especially in Ireland, people aren't adept at.

What we are seeing is that there is a big movement right now of what we call thin other answers here in Ireland and the government is starting to pay attention to them. There is a financial literacy task force and initiative being undertaken here in Ireland. I think a lot of great work has been done and the reach that these thin influencers have on channels like Instagram, TikTok, etcetera is meaningful. And we are finding that the younger generation might, kids included, my 13 year old daughter, they're starting to seep into her feed, which I'm happy about etcetera.

And when I say feed, it's one that we would curate on her our behalf, but she's starting to learn about money at younger age because she's being reached by these people who are talking about money in an easy to understand way. It's not a textbook that they have to learn in school. And they're they're getting the message out and resting it coherent and oftentimes very credible manner. So things are changing drastically.

And whilst I am not in favour of young people getting access to social media prior to the age of 16, there are certain things that I would consciously share with my 13 year old daughter around items like that. So that they can build financial literacy and we can enable everybody to think about how they can build wealth and from a young age just get better at thinking about money and encourage them to be entrepreneurial and to think about risk as being something that's healthy once it's managed.

So I'm hugely positive about the future and I'm hugely positive about how things are going in Ireland. It will take time, but that was part of the mission behind Nested Fight. When we looked at Ireland and Europe, we thought as the VCs would say, there is more of a blue ocean, whereas the US is more red ocean. There's huge opportunity in the US, but Europe is somewhat untapped in comparison with the with the market in the US.

It's really wonderful to hear in a way because it aside from you just coming up with this, hey, I have a problem for my own kids that I want to solve. I love the purpose driven nature that you're talking about for nest defying of like, Hey, I want to make sure that I not only solve this for me and my family, I want to solve it for families all over the world. And I want to make sure that, you know, these global communities are, are better connected, you know, financial sense.

So it's really inspiring. So like I do want to ask you like thinking of like your own founder journey, like because obviously when people think of founders, they think of the grind and like how much you have to like persevere and really push through. How much of this purpose is actually driving your day-to-day? Like how much is it helping you persevere and grind through on those tough days?

Hugely. Hugely. When I think about the people who have backed us so far, all the investors we have, we did a crowdfunding campaign recently. It was oversubscribed, everybody to speak to.

There's a demand for the product. People are saying, has anybody cracked this yet? Where can I set up an account for my children? So the more you hear that and the more I see it myself, and I'm itching, I am impatient.

I am just unbelievably determined to get this to market quickly. We believe we've all of the right things in place. The infrastructure, the technology, the network, the connections, the distribution is there. We're itching to get this going and to get adoption.

And I believe there will be massive take part. And yes, when I think about my own four children, whenever we do a demo to an institution with the the front end application, which can be white labelled for the institution. The way we've organised it, if I can visually describe is at the top of the the mobile app, at least you've got a circle for the family and that's the name of the family. That could be the Dennehy family.

And then there are little circles where you can have an icon or some form of like Memoji representing the cohort of your family, your kids. And in my case, there are emojis for each of my children that I can tap on. And as part of the demo, when I'm sharing that, I talk about their names, I talk about their ages and I relate it back to my own experience. And that for me then when I think about it, and I viewed from the prism of being a parent of children myself, it does really give me fuel to keep the, uh, you know, this fire going.

And there are always in any journey, in any job, etcetera, everyday does get tough. And I keep that in the back of my mind that I know there are hundreds of thousands of people out there around the world who want solution like this and who need it and who will benefit from it and who we can reach. So it's hugely inspiring and it's a mission that everybody can relate to and one that we are truly passionate about. And yes, being a parent, it comes back to that myself and wanting to build a hugely powerful solution with that I can use myself, that I know when I'm using it, I'm going to be obsessing over thinking about it, constantly tweaking it, how we can improve it and really treat it like a Craftsman or craftswoman would and make it sure that it's just the finest product that one can build and.

It must be resonating. I mean, it's very clearly resonating because not only do you have actual customers and you're engaging with credit unions and and various other financial institutions. As you said, you recently had an oversubscribed fundraising ran. So congratulations on that.

Firstly, what during that process, like fundraising is often one of the more difficult things in the early stages of, of being a founder and building something. Um, during that time, like during that time, like what were you hearing from the people that were investing? Were you hearing them going? Ohh we see this opportunity but we also feel this pain ourselves as well.

That's it. So the campaign that we ran on Spark Venture Funding, which is a great platform that ended last Friday, we were 108% oversubscribed. We got 134 people last time I checked, investing through their platform. And what I found was I got some people who reached out directly to me on channels like LinkedIn, etcetera, has seen the company, has seen the video, they like what they were doing.

I had one guy from North Kerry recently, for example, left a voicemail on the company. My phone said he liked this. Could he use it to put a small amount of money away every month for his grandchildren? And I also had a pretty sophisticated guy who had recently retired for a Morgan Stanley, an MD there, reached out as well and loved the mission.

And we've had a huge amount of people who have connected with us to say that. First of all, generally, I'm always amazed at how polite people are and the amount of goodness out there. But oftentimes, especially Irish people would, I guess, predicate their messaging. But I'm not going to be annoying.

You know what, I just want to let you know that I put a small amount of money into the venture. I really like this when it goes live, I want to be able to use it. And there are some people that I can introduce at the following institutions for you. And we've had leads come in through that through people connecting because they had they have skin in the game now, but also very respectful, very polite.

And there were I can see how much people invested some more, some less. But the one thing that's consistent and given that the Irish people largely, and I would imagine it's the same, you know, the world around the amount of respect and how polite people were and how willing to help people were when we could reach them through a platform that is a base of 15,000 people. But it's, it's been great. And that was part of the reason that we went, went ahead with it.

We were debating earlier on, do we do this, do we go under the radar a bit longer, do we announce the partnerships to clients that were generating our revenue were up and to the right, etcetera. But the more we talked about it and knowing people who had raised money in that capacity, we figured that at its core, honesty is somewhat like families crowdfunding for themselves and their children. It would resonate. And the pitch video that we put together, which was around 9 minutes in length, which told the story that I mentioned at the start of the video about my mother opening the account in the credit union, we had some footage of the 1980s in Ireland and the credit union.

It resonated with people and that's what people picked up. So yes, it all worked outwell in the end, albeit a lot of grind, effort, slog promotion goes into it, talking about it. And there are of course lulls in the campaign where we thought, God, we're not going to hit our target here. But then we ended up blowing by it.

But that's where you've got to put your shoulders in the wheel, promote it, and nothing, as we know, comes easy in this world if. You could go back. If you could go back 18 months now, then what's one thing you'd be telling yourself? Should have done it sooner would be realistically take why not built this sooner.

But I've got so many things up in the air. Actually, I think the timing was perfect and there has been a big sea change in the attitude of people in Europe that is predicated by Geo geopolitics in a way. And when you look at there's a lot of movement happening now in Europe around the savings and investment Union that wasn't really being talked about back in 18 months ago. And people talk about how we can, you know, implement the Draggy report and how Ireland, how Europe needs to have more strategic autonomy.

We need to invest in European companies. We need to promote companies that are doing things. So I think the market actually is in a much better place now than it was 18 months ago. So I would have said do it sooner.

However, I think we actually picked a really sweet time to do it. And this conversation around that intergenerational wealth and the explosion of, you know, companies in the I, I think, I think we've, we've nailed the timing when I look back, but other than starting earlier. That's all they would change. Amazing.

Well, there's always there is always something though, of like as much as I, and I hear this a lot from founders of like, I wish I had done this earlier, but there is something to hitting it at the right time. Because I've, I've spoken to people who have had great ideas, but they were either just that couple of years too early or they were too late in the game And they were like not only the second mover, they were like the 4th or 5th over at that point. But it does really feel like that you've kind of found that sweet spot as a founder where you've timed it very well.

I believe we have. It's all about timing. I think it's all about the team, team, team. We went, I went through tech stars in 2016 myself with another venture.

And the one thing that they talk about in an early stage company is that it's team, team, team. Then I believe it was the the market and then the idea. Ideas are cheap, but timing. Then I think this thing that's, you know, hangs them all together and this confluence of you, OHH, the A I Zunami or supersonic, you know, wave that's coming at us right now and the things that we can do that we weren't able to do, you know, pre ChatGPT timing is great and this conversation around wealth, but everything is aligned really well and we find everyday there's more recognition around the need to start early and to help families build wealth in a collaborative manner.

So our timing has been, I'd like to think, near impeccable. 18 months from now, let's just say we we bring you back onto the podcast to get an update on how things are going. What would you like to be talking about? Like what does success look like to you?

Yeah. Really, really for us it's being seeing the technology adopted by loads of, I don't give a number yet, but credit unions are a real big focus for us in the US, also in Europe and Tier 2 community banks in the US getting our technology adopted by them. We've white labelled it for them. That's really the number one game and sound right now and it's the accounts that are opened up through our platform.

The amount of assets that are managed are under direction for our platform is where we're aiming for, but as widespread distribution adoption as we can get with credit unions and community banks being our core market that we're going after on both sides of the Atlantic, in particular Ireland. We think the credit union space deserves better technology and that's where we want to get its adoption of the technology. More accounts opened and assets under management through our platform, the bigger the better.

We do have targets, we do have KPIs, we do have a numbers that we're aiming for and I'd love to come back in 18 months time and tell you honestly if we've hit them or not, but I'm confident that we will. And before we close out, is there anything that the digital Irish community could be helping you out with? Is it introductions, warm introductions or whatever it is? Is there anything that comes to mind?

The number one thing right now is basically clients, access to clients, any helpful introductions for anybody that this resonates with? If you're working at an institution, you're part of the Digital Irish community, come and talk to us. Even if it's validation for what we have right now or a conversation for something that can be happened down the line. But it's really adoption of our technology.

And that's what I love about the network that Digital Irish has, you know, across the world. And it's the helpfulness of people in general. But I think Irish people, one of our super powers, hands down, I don't think we're, I'm being biassed here, but we are the best connectors, networkers, talkers. A lot of that can be high falutin waffle at times.

But I think there's nobody better than Irish people at making those human connections. And that's really what we're doing, but in a financial manner. So anybody who's listening feels that Nest defies something that they could use at their own institution or they know somebody where we can make an impact. Any interest would be much, much appreciated.

And reach out directly on LinkedIn, on ex WhatsApp. We are available 24/7. Fantastic stuff Niall, thank you so much for taking out the time. Again, this has been really fascinating to hear.

Congratulations again on the round and best of luck for the months ahead. And hopefully there will be few people from the community that reach out off the back of listening to this episode. I appreciate it. Yeah.

Thank you so much, Dave. Great to talk and that is? It for today's episode, a massive thank you Daniel Dennehy from Investor Fried for joining me. It's a very rare conversation about fintech that comes back to the family.

So I really appreciated this conversation. And as an I'll touched on, yes, they want to make money, but it is a very purpose driven company. If there's one thing to take away, it's that starting early matters more than starting big. Whether it's a small gift, a credit union account or a few euro a month from the wider family, the earlier the compounding starts, the better off that child will be.

If you want to see what masterpiece building do check them out. Nile is on LinkedIn as well. Links are in the show notes. If you enjoyed today's episode, please do share it with the parents or grandparents who may get something from it.

And if you haven't already subscribed to us wherever you listen to your podcast, Until next time, Sunday full.