22: Exploring Food and Beverage Trends in the Meetings Industry with Greg O’Dell and Ken Gaber

Speaker A: Hello, everyone, and welcome to between the Sessions. Coming to you from the beautiful Palm Beaches, Florida. Between the Sessions is a podcast for meetings industry professionals, is presented by the Palm Beaches, and I'm your host, Suzanne Boyd. Today we are excited to, um, have two guests with us from the Oak View Group. Um, they are rock stars in the venue space. We have Greg o', Dell, who's the president of venue management, and Ken Gaber, who is the president of OVG Hospitality. Thank you both for joining us today.

Speaker B: Thanks, Suzanne, for having us. We're excited to be with you.

Speaker A: So, Greg, let's start with you. Tell us a little bit about yourself, your role with Oakview Group and how you got into this meetings and event space.

Speaker B: Yeah, sure. So I've been with Oakview Group, uh, just under two years now. And prior to that I ran what was called Events dc, which was the convention and sports authority in Washington, dc. So, you know, I've been very fortunate to manage a, you know, great portfolio and a great destination and, you know, this opportunity to come on board with, you know, Oakview Group was a chance of a lifetime. Like, it's an amazing company, but we really are kind of providing, you know, full menu, suite of services, but also wanting to frankly change the world. Like, we, we really believe in being a positive disruption in this space. And so I personally, my background didn't have the opportunity to work in hospitality initially. I really was on the construction and development side and got involved on the venue side. Uh, and that's how I cut my teeth in operations. So it's just been a wonderful experience. We're growing like crazy, as Ken and I were happy to tell you. But it's a great company and we're happy to provide lots of services and opportunities and experiences for our clients.

Speaker A: Awesome. Ken, what about you? Tell us a little bit about your background.

Speaker C: Yeah. So thank you for having us. I've been at OAKV Group, uh, OVG Hospitality for just over two years. Greg and I started right around the same time and it's. And it's been a rocket ship ever since. Um, I literally started doing food and beverage and operations since I was 14 years old, where I started off as a mascot at a Miley Basel stadium and working in concessions and working my way up in school at Johnson and Wales University in Providence. And, uh.

Speaker A: Wait, I have to stop you. You said you were a mascot.

Speaker C: I was, uh, I was, I was

Speaker A: like, okay, what was the mascot?

Speaker C: I was a third tier tater, the gator for the Norse Navigators. So, like, not even like, not even at Basel Stadium. Like a Walmart appearance and stuff, which is great.

Speaker A: It's amazing.

Speaker B: Do you still have the outfit I'd like to see?

Speaker C: I do not. I do remember it was always in the summertime and it was always hot and it was really smelly on the inside. But that's how you cut your teeth, I guess they say.

Speaker A: That's right. Okay, I'm sorry I interrupted you.

Speaker C: Yeah, no, it's uh. So I've been doing this, uh, my whole life and um, worked my way around a few other companies. Uh, before working with Oak Group, uh, prior to Oakview Group, I helped design and innovate a lot of our new buildings. Uh, Klein, ah, Pledge Arena, UBS Arena, Moody Center. Um, and then when OBG acquired Spectra back in November, uh, of 21, uh, I decided to come over here and be the president. And ever since then we've doubled, uh, and tripled our company in the past two years because we focus on innovation, we focus on speed of service, we focus on taking care of the customer and doing what's right by the customer and everything else falls into place.

Speaker A: So. And just, um, to clarify, you all operate and manage the um, Palm Beach County Convention center here in the Palm Beaches. So tell us a little bit about that role, Greg.

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean it's, it's an amazing partnership. Look, I think uh, it's wonderful to have a destination that really supports the tourism and convention and even sports entertainment industry. So it's been a great partnership to see the vision and the investment that's made, uh, by the city, by the county. We've been fortunate. And then, you know, we've had great staff there, you know, obviously working closely with the CBB and that amazing team. And then our general manager, um, for the venue side, Dave Anderson, does an incredible job, um, and it's just exciting to see the growth and opportunity there. So, you know, it's been amazing events that have continued to occur in that building. I love, uh, every time we get a chance to go down and experience some of the great events that are happening there, but also what's to come. And Ken, I know can speak to the food and beverage side and what that team has also been doing there.

Speaker A: Yeah, I do want to talk a little bit about that because we, you know, we want to talk about trends and what's happening in the industry. So, you know, Ken, what are some of the trends that are happening in the food and beverage, um, industry when it comes to meetings?

Speaker C: Yeah, I would say the biggest one is you're healthy or full food, healthier food options in um, general that's not, not just like uh, you know, kale salads but it's, it's vegan, vegetarian, gluten free, plant based, like tofu based. Really looking outside of your meat and potatoes or your surf and turf, uh, that has like been readily known within the industry for, for a long time. There's a lot more expectations on great quality food, um, but also food that hits a wider, wider variety of, of your customer. Um, so we're seeing a lot of things um, that are specific to each individual client. Um, so a lot of customized menus, um, a lot of zero proof cocktails as well. Um, so we've gotten rid of the name mocktails, uh, a fake cocktail and really gone to zero proof because they deserve their own light and understanding. Kind of not everybody out there is an alcohol drinker anymore. Um, there's other ways, especially in large conventions and meetings and looking at um, great tasting beverages that are focused on those zero proof cocktails. And there's more variety now than there's ever been um, in the history of cocktails that are heavily focused on zero proof. The other two I would say is your sustainability. Ah, sustainability is huge right now and what um, the meeting and event planners are looking for. Um, and then the last one I would say is supplier diversity. It's a huge conversation that we've taken on as a company and we're also seeing within the uh, meeting planners convent center side that people want to know where the food is coming from, the product is coming from. They want to know where the supplies are coming from. They also want to make sure that there's uh, people represented that haven't been represented before.

Speaker A: And Greg, what about you in the venue space? Um, what trends are you seeing in venue management?

Speaker B: Yeah, I would say probably the biggest one. There's been a couple and some have been kind of the outgrowth from COVID one that I think and it bodes well for Palm beach and that is kind of this use of external spaces. Right. So from COVID first thing we had to do is, was gather safely and a lot of times we relied on external places. Well I think that's been a good thing that has also kind of now trend and continue to be a mainstay. And so um, we're seeing more and more requests from clients to have external spaces as part of their overall experience. And I know there in Palm beach there's the Sky Room that was developed and what's nice about it it's not just external space, but it comes with the amenities required. Right. You have audio, you have lighting, you have beautiful art. And I think those are the things that distinguish, um, a destination or a building. And so we definitely see a lot more of that and then just general flexible spaces. Right. I think you'll see more and more buildings that are getting designed and even existing buildings that have been renovated that will now accommodate flex space. And so I think, you know, customers just want options and choices and be able to create their own spaces and these experiences. And I think any building, um, that can adapt to that will do well by the customer base.

Speaker A: Yeah, we recently spoke with Derek from um, the Hilton West Palm beach, which is the hotel attached to the Palm Beach Convention Center. And you know, he was saying the same thing that that sort of flex space, that outdoor space, and he's had meetings where people have, um, just used their entire pool deck area for piece of the, of the event. Um, so even stuff like that, where you're using that outdoor space or those flex spaces, uh, I would recommend all

Speaker B: our meetings be outdoors at a pool

Speaker A: in February in South Florida. Yes, 100, not necessarily in August in South Florida. Um, so let's talk about some of the challenges that meeting planners, um, are facing in this day and age. Ken, what are some of the biggest challenges, um, when planning FMB four of these meetings and conventions?

Speaker C: Yeah, I would say the. Some of the biggest challenges are, you know, some of the flexibility, um, within the size of groups that they're looking for, uh, as it relates to just kind of budgetary spends, um, some organizational spends, some layout, uh, functionality. What they're also looking for is like the creativity, um, in venues. And I think that's where there's a lot of people who have a lot of voices, um, as it relates to the creativity. And we definitely want to be as creative as possible. Um, so I think looking at different ways to hit every customer, um, and being as creative as possible is probably one of the hardest, but it's also one of the most fulfilling, um, because we try to do our best job every single day and creating that memorable experience. And kind of some of the factors that go in, especially with layouts and as you said, uh, being outside in August, September in South Florida, not the most flexible, uh, but we try to make it happen if we can.

Speaker B: And I would add, Susan, just generally across the board cost has been an issue with inflation or otherwise. And so I think getting the headcount, the accuracy of what you think your drops are going to be are really important to control costs because at the end of the day someone has to bear those costs. And so we always try to find where it's a win win and either the building or our customer doesn't have to take the hit. And so that's been a challenge. And costs unfortunately have continued to increase or whether it's been, you know, for supplies or food costs or otherwise. And so I don't know that that's going to stop anytime soon or dissipate. So I think we all have to figure out, you know, how we can help work together mitigate those costs.

Speaker C: Yeah, I think food inflation in general has gone up on average on uh, the past four years. About 7% per year on average. Right. So at the end of the day the cost from, you know, the manufacturer or the supplier to, to uh, the end user, which is the guest, there's cost all along. And I think that's where some of these budgetary concerns are coming in because it's rising as faster than normal inflation.

Speaker A: Any suggestions on how planners can work with those suppliers or venue partners to overcome those challenges or bring those costs down?

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean I think, you know, we, we all rush into kind of the planning exercise, but I think providing a lot of um, data from previous events really will help give us a lot more certainty. Right. So that we can all kind of better guesstimate what we think the costs are going to be. And it's not that that doesn't happen now, but I think it's more important to be realistic. You may expect a certain attendance. Right. But if you know in the last two years, particularly post Covid that you're trending in a certain direction, let's be realistic about those costs and that we can help or those attendee numbers and that will help really better inform us about what the costs are going to be. And look, you know, we all want to make sure that we're eyes wide open and working together. So I think we just have to have some candid conversations. But also sharing in real time would be very helpful, um, for us to solve for each other's problems.

Speaker C: Yeah. And I think from a uh, food and beverage, it's getting out there. Having meetings 612 months in advance, as far advance as we can have them and you know, really kind of hone in exactly the what important, what's important to the guests, what are some of the food stories we want to tell within um, the, the event and then also making sure that we're having the menu planning and the tastings uh, to make sure that those are exactly what you're looking for. Um, and we're putting the right money where we're supposed to and putting some money into other locations where maybe it doesn't add as much value to your convention or conference.

Speaker A: Ken, you had mentioned earlier, two of the hot topics right now in the meetings industry are sustainability and wellness. Um, I want to dive a little bit deeper into that. You had talked about the wellness and how you can incorporate that into the menus. What are you all doing on the F and B side, um, as far as sustainability is concerned?

Speaker C: Yeah. So right from the beginning, it's having a sustainability playbook and showing a lot of the great things that you're already doing. You know, one of the original OG sustainability is china glassware. Right. You know, things that you can wash and not disposable. Um, and we've kind of gone away because of speed of service, uh, to some of the china glassware, um, utensils.

Speaker A: It's also a lot nicer.

Speaker C: Yeah, it's truly going back to getting rid of the paper cups, of the coffee breaks and actually using china and making sure that you're heavily focused. The other things are making sure that you know where the products are coming from. Right. What's the radius around, um, if you're able to buy locally and buy sustainable, working with local vendors and local restaurateurs to make sure that, you know, your supplier diversity is, Is part of your sustainability movement, where the food isn't moving many times, and then also just making sure that you are articulating and you have the. The handouts and the graphics of everything that you're doing. You know, we have a lot of conferences, uh, conventions that are looking for certain certifications, um, you know, trash certifications, uh, you know, zero waste certifications, um, and being able to hit those. It's. We're already doing a lot of it as part of food and beverage, um, and that's articulating what we're already doing and then taking the next step with the conference or convention to make sure that, you know, we're getting those certifications that they're asking for or requiring.

Speaker B: And Susan, I would add, uh, you know, I feel like it's the. We are at the point now where it's no longer a trend. Right. It used to be where sustainability was a buzzword. And, you know, we would all talk a good game or everybody would have these glossy brochures, but not real action. So I, I do say, I think that turning point is here. Um, we only need to look to places like Europe and others that are frankly ahead of us where those are now becoming steadfast requirements. And so we've found that our, the meeting planners are asking for, you know, data on the performance of the buildings. They certainly want to be able to track the performance of their experience in their conference or convention at our venues. And so it's good to see it's not without, um, a lot more planning and effort. Uh, we're proud to say, you know, for Ken and I, both as a company, that's something that we've leaned into very hard. Uh, we have a program called Goal. Goal really does two things. Um, and it's member based, but it allows us to really track performance. So we have uh, an actual performance measuring system that we put in place that can either track the venue or track specifically the performance of a meeting, uh, at your show. And then also it has a repository of kind of best practices for us. And so that we think is also important so that we're, we're actually walking the walk so we can share what type of um, sustainability practices that we can implement and help our customers implement. So we just think it's here to stay and we want to uh, really make sure we're not only doing our part but also hopefully leading in this, in this space. And we've had some great partners, from professional teams to some signature venues that are members. So we're proud and we're going to continue to grow that.

Speaker A: You know, I am in Delray beach and we have meetings and conventions, mostly, um, meetings in our um, little village by the sea, which is in Palm Beach County. Um, we can't handle, you know, large convention groups or huge, um, uh, huge groups. But how is it, Ken, how is it different to handle food and beverage for these giant, um, you know, convention center meetings and conventions and stadiums as compared to the smaller events?

Speaker C: I would say it's different but the same. It's different in the sense that, you know, there's more associates you have to manage, more team members. We have to manage, um, if you look at something like McCormick Place, we have over 60 managers and we have 2,000 associates, um, versus maybe a meeting center where you may have two or three managers and uh, 100 associates. So the training is different, um, because you have to train on scale. We um, also have to be more interactive with our associates because there's uh, preferreds, long ends, casuals where maybe somebody only works a couple events a year, but making sure that you have the same standards and Process where. And mainly like kind of meeting, uh, halls and meeting centers. They're a little bit, uh, you have the same work staff almost every single day, um, and you can have those standards set. The other part is just ah, the planning of it. Planning a plated meal for you know, 18,000 people or planning a uh, you know, chef table for you know, 14,000 people that have multi different uh, courses or uh, international food options as part of these chef tables and phase, um, there's a lot more planning that has to go into some of these larger functions where they may be two or three years in planning. Some of the major ones, where some of the other ones may be six or eight months. So one of the other ah, kind of major things in large commencement centers are the amount of facilities that they have. Especially with amount of kitchens. You know, McCormick Place as an example, we have seven different kitchens, kitchens with you know, a whole suite of different, you know, uh, ovens and rationales and great things that you can make great food with. Uh, where maybe in other facilities we don't. So I'd say it's the same because the process is taking care of the customer and you know, the, the scale of the associate, amount of associates while the scale of the facilities are different. But um, at the end of the day it's taking care of the customer and you know, making sure that you put on great food and beverage and it's served hot when it's hot and served cold when it's supposed to be cold. And it's also, you know, fresh tasting ingredients.

Speaker A: And Ken, uh, just as a follow up to that, because you had mentioned some of the restaurants providing F and B and in some of those, some of those events. Talk to me a little bit about partnering with local restaurants to provide F and B for some of these meetings and conventions.

Speaker C: Yeah, we do that all the time and everywhere across the country. And the biggest thing is that we want to be a true representation of our community. Um, and that is part of the working with our local associates. But that's the other part is working with local restaurateurs. So when our guests come to our convention and visitors halls as an example, they are able to see kind of what's local and what's out in the community. And also, you know, it's a great representation of the food story within the community if we can have it in one location. Um, and that's what these buildings are. They're communal meeting places at the end of the day and making sure that the local is represented just as much as our national brands.

Speaker A: And Greg, let's talk a little bit about, um, moving. Let's say your event has gotten to the point where you can move it to the convention center instead of in house. Uh, what do you need to think about before making that change?

Speaker B: Yeah, it's a great question. And we've seen clients who've successfully, um, as you mentioned, elevate from a smaller venue. The one thing I will say is in some cases, particularly the example you gave Susan about a hotel, is that the hotel experience is usually all inclusive of all services, you know, contained in one location. And when you're moving to a convention center, you know, oftentimes they have to worry about um, separating or segregating some of those services that they had and even some of the functions of their program in multiple locations. So that logistically can be a challenge for people who haven't done it before sounds, you know, easier said than done. But then also in many cases there's real costs associated with that. Right? You have multiple venues, multiple contracts, and in some cases you're also having to transport, um, equipment, material, supplies, people. So I just think, you know, being realistic about what the additional cost are in some of the logistics. Sometimes when you're graduating from uh, a hotel or a smaller venue, going to the convention center, but oftentimes you're doing that for a reason. You're growing and now you need more space. And so I think it's a great positive opportunity. But you just have to be eyes wide open as to what some of those challenges may be, whether it's financially or logistically to accommodate that growth.

Speaker A: You know, a lot of, I feel like a lot of people, um, when we talk to them, they're talking about unique experience that they want to bring to their events and uh, doing things that maybe are a little bit unexpected. Um, Ken, can you talk a little bit about curating these sort of high end, unique experiences for show planners and how you guys do that on the FMB side?

Speaker C: Yeah, we're definitely seeing more and more um, of uh, the higher end experience or the bespoke experiences, uh, within the meeting events space. And it's really because the status quo is not good anymore. Right? We need to keep uh, on elevating and the expectation of our guests, especially coming to conventions and spending thousands of dollars in hotel and airfare and um, the convention itself, they're expecting what the next level up is and a lot of it is working with those local chefs or national chefs and creating a whole food and wine experience. Uh, within the, uh, within the, the a meeting or a gala or you know, um, maybe in a pre function space to bring people together. Right? You, you want that, you know, kismet, the crush period of everybody kind of meeting together and, and uh, talking and it's really revolves around food in a lot of places. So it's. We're seeing more small bites, more bespoke, uh, specialty, uh, foods. You know, the food of the area, um, you know, the, you know, the tourism food of the area, it wants to be highly represented. Uh, whether you're in Boston and you're looking for a lobster roll or Chicago looking for the Chicago dog or you know, looking for the stone crabs as an example. Those are all things that are our consumer wants and they need to be on full display. But it also needs to have the show with it, the action, right, the theater to make sure that, you know, it's in the special vessels or you know, there's some kind of movement going around and you know, some kind of, ah, large, I uh, know large spectacle as it relates to it. So food is always present, um, but the spectacle around it is also as important and that's what we're seeing more and more. Um, whereas people look at, you know, where they're, where they're putting their budget is on these, you know, one or two or three major experiences. Um, and then you know, even like the large feedings, mass feedings that we've had in the past kind of go away for these, the money's going to some of these larger experiences.

Speaker A: Greg, anything to add from your perspective?

Speaker B: Yeah, the only thing I would say, and this is where Ken and I have the benefit of working with other venue types and other industries like sports entertainment. People are craving the premium experience more so than ever, and they'll pay top dollar for it. So we found that whether it's the ultimate luxury suite experience in an arena or whether it's that bespoke experience that Ken's speaking about as part of the meeting or a VIP experience as part of that meeting. Like we found that people want that. They have more choices now and they're more uh, discriminatory about whether they're going to travel or not. And so when they do, they want the best experience possible. And so it's great because that means people are willing to spend more. But it also means we have to fulfill that promise and create that experience for them. So we see it as a great opportunity as a company. And Ken can talk more about this. Like we've been acquiring other Food and beverage experiences that he should expand on. Uh, that really kind of puts us on that trajectory to meet that expectation. So I'll defer to the master on that one to talk a little bit more about that.

Speaker C: Yeah, we're heavily involved in kind of reshaping what the premium experience is, um, in general. So back about nine months ago we acquired a company called Rhubarb. Rhubarb does everything from running the restaurant at Peak in one, uh, hundred second floor of Hudson Yards which is a amazing food and wine experience, uh, to they, they work in London and they run Sky Garden which is another, you know, one um, hundredth floor restaurants, uh, three of them. But they do everything from Buckingham Palace Christmas party to uh, Royal Ascot, right? These like really, really like high end premium experiences. So we acquired them. Now we're relating that, putting uh, putting that mentality into the rest of our business. And we just acquired a uh, membership only club, um, just last week called Invited, ah, Stadium club. So these are members social clubs within stadiums, um, that are open up 360 days a year where a member can you know, join on and go to and have that social membership club. But also the premium experience, the premium bar experience, the premium events experience. Um, so we're seeing more and more of the heavy focus on premium. And then we also looking on the other side of our business of bespoke events. We did a great event uh, uh, for F1 in Las Vegas where we literally, you know, bought a whole turnout turn 12, right. Uh, near the Fashion Mall. And uh, it was 30,000 a ticket for two people including hotel rooms. But a true epicurean experience with uh, you know, chefs and action and wine and food and you know, great concepts and you know, great showcase. But what we're seeing from that point is that the premium, uh, we call them P1 experiences, uh, P1 experiences in sports entertainment are selling probably faster than some other experiences out there because there are people willing to buy these experiences and they, they crave them, they want them. You know, it's uh, they want to be at the event and they want to be at the showcase, but they want to also have that different layer of experience.

Speaker B: And Suzanne, they're, they're not, you know, the beauty for us is like they're not mutually exclusive. Like we want to combine these experiences. So if you're coming to uh, Palm Beach Convention center and we actually happen to manage another venue that does sports entertainment, not to be named, but there's one in Palm beach that we're working on with you all on. But why not give that meeting planner who's there for meeting that experience, right? So they can not only have a meeting there, but then they can enjoy some of these other high premium experiences. And so we just feel like that's where the trend is going. People are certainly willing to pay for it if you create it. So we just have to work with great partners like Palm beach to do that. But we think there's definitely an appetite for it and we're thankful that our company really is investing in moving in that direction.

Speaker A: Um, so one of our final questions we ask that you put yourselves in the shoes of the meeting guests or the convention guests. Um, and it's basically a question about what's happening between the sessions of these meetings and conventions. Um, and I want to know what your favorite like memory or activity or experience has been between the sessions of any of these conferences or meetings that you've been to.

Speaker B: Greg, I will say I was hoping you were going to ask Ken first, but I'm kidding. You know, I will say when I, when I go somewhere, um, and it's not that the meeting is not important, but you know, typically you're going to prepare for that and you're going to hopefully, um, make the connections that you need to make in a very safe, convenient and comfortable environment and hope that you have a great experience. But what I probably crave the most is also getting the authenticity of that destination or other things that I can experience that I wouldn't experience otherwise. And so if I get to go to a very cool venue or if I get to go experience that high end food and beverage experience or the different food that may be, um, indigenous to that location, like that's what I actually crave the most. And I try to plan and think about how I'm going to do that while I have 20 other things to do while, um, I'm there for two days. And so that to me is, is what I enjoy the most in those sessions. And when I, when I travel for

Speaker C: meetings like that, Ken I would say, yeah, I would say it's very similar, Greg said, in the sense that, you know, going to these places and putting the time, you know, that is necessary to travel and to be part of it and be present within the space. Right. Also getting something, you know, personal out of it and, you know, making sure that I'm connecting with the right people, uh, you know, the friends that I had that are going to these sessions, but also seeing kind of the city itself and seeing the culture around the city Um, a lot of times, Greg. Ah. And I. Greg and I probably travel, I would say, three fourths of the year. And, you know, so many times we're in and out of the city, um, that we travel to because we're there for a meeting. And the one thing about conventions is that, you know, we dedicate, you know, two to three days for these conventions, and, you know, we're able to, you know, take an hour of downtime and seeing some of the sites and also seeing stuff around the convention center. You know, a lot of these, uh, public spaces were built in, uh, certain locations that, you know, some sometimes weren't developed at the time. And, you know, how the city has developed around them is also really interesting to see. And, you know, immersing yourself around the local neighborhoods.

Speaker A: What's your favorite spot? I'm going to put you on the spot. It's okay if you don't say the Palm Beaches.

Speaker C: No, I do love the. I do love the Palm Beaches. Uh, no, um, I would say my favorite is because I worked there, but then I came back. I worked there and then I came back as a guest. Uh, one of it was Boston. Um, so I worked there for a couple of years. And then, uh, seeing Boston kind of redevelop over, over time in that seaport, when I worked there, there wasn't much around, and I went back there, I think, like two years ago and seeing the amount of development around the bcec, so I think that was the most memorable. Uh, Palm beach, the weather is always great, right? It's, uh, you know, the local community is great and we have a great team down there. So, like, when I go to Palm beach, it's more because I'm working, um, and seeing the team down there. So, like, I don't get to appreciate as much as, as a guest, but I would say that Boston was probably the, the most wild one because I was immersed in there for so long and then stepping away for years and then going back there as a guest was really, uh, spectacular to see.

Speaker A: Okay, so final question. We always ask, um, about swag, and typically swag is the stuff we all get. But on between the Sessions podcast, we're asking you to give us a tip or piece of advice for our listeners. So, Greg, one piece of advice or tip for meeting planners?

Speaker B: Any kind of advice?

Speaker A: Yeah, anything that would help them.

Speaker B: Okay. Yeah, no, fair enough. I think in our conversation, which was great today, we talked about just mitigating costs or problems. I think, for us, um, and for meeting planners as great partners, that we can be for the venue, share any and everything with us. We actually want to be part of the solution. And so I think too often we all hold information close to the vest on both sides. But even if it has nothing to do with us, we've probably seen it in other venues like for Ken and I as an example. So I would just say in this day and age, however untraditional that conversation may be, I just would lean onto your partners even in a non traditional way because I think people have great solutions out there.

Speaker C: Ken, I would say full uh, transparency, uh, as you go into these meetings, be as transparent as possible with the food and beverage, with, you know, conversion with, with whoever you're meeting to, uh, because the, you know, as you get closer and closer and closer and things start popping up that you may have known before, you know, that kind of stalls uh, things out. So just make sure that everything is everybody's full transparent and everybody will have the greatest event possible within the budgets that are uh, trying to be obtained. But you know, if uh, we're always trying to chase something, then it's uh, you know, kind of moving in circles a little bit sometimes.

Speaker A: Yeah, chasing a moving target.

Speaker C: Yeah, exactly.

Speaker A: All right, well, Ken Gaber and Greg o' Dell from Oakview Group, thank you so much for joining us today. We really appreciate it. And between the Sessions is part of the Destination Marketing podcast network. We thank you all for listening. And you can join us on LinkedIn, the Palm Beaches on LinkedIn or on our website thepalmbeaches.com meetings. Make sure you subscribe and like leave a review on your favorite podcast platform. This has been an episode of between the Sessions. Mhm.