721. Four Leaders on Mergers, Burnout, and Radical Honesty with Funders - Stacy Huston, Lindsey Fuller, Tammy Tibbetts, and Becky Straw

Speaker A: M. What does it look like to lead without the traditional nonprofit playbook? Today's conversation from the We Are for Good summit, uh, features four leaders who are doing exactly that. Questioning the defaults, trying unconventional things, and choosing resilience over the status quo. This conversation is beautifully led by our friend Stacy Houston, CEO of SixDegrees.org it's honest, practical, and we hope you get as much from it as we did.

Speaker B: Hey, I'm John.

Speaker A: And I'm Becky.

Speaker B: And this is the We Are for Good podcast. Podcast.

Speaker A: Let's get started.

Speaker C: Hi, everyone, and welcome back. I'm Stacy Houston. I'm the CEO of SixDegrees.org and a social impact strategist who works at the intersection of storytelling, influence, and action. Many of you in this room are leaders and fundraisers who know the traditional nonprofit playbook, but also feel its limits. And there are so many limits that we impose on ourselves. Today's conversation is about leaders who are questioning those defaults and choosing different paths. We'll explore unconventional moves around people, power partnerships, focus, and operations that are expanding resilience and unblocking new forms of support. I'm, um, excited to be joined by an incredible group of nonprofit leaders. Together, they're all going to share what they've tried, what they've learned, and that they're intentionally doing differently. So you can take all these ideas back to your own organizations right away. So let's just dive right in. You're a big fan of grounding Lindsay, so in, uh, order to ground us for this conversation, how about we go around and we share a little bit about our organizations? And one myth that you have kind of busted wide open with leadership or social impact, something that you've believed and you've decided no more. Let's start with you.

Speaker D: Yeah.

Speaker E: Yes. Well, um, she's the First is an organization that I co founded 17 years ago almost. And we put girls front and center in our work, um, because we believe every girl should be educated, respected, and heard. We do that by working directly with girls all around the world to teach them about their rights, um, and how they can make a change in their communities. And we work with the adults and girls lives, their mentors, and their educators, um, worldwide, but especially in East Africa, South Asia, and Latin America. The myth that I think I have debunked is that, uh, because we are going through a merger now, it's almost finalized with Girl Rising.

Speaker F: Congratulations.

Speaker E: Peer organization that I have long admired. So, uh, a lot to share about that experience. Um, we believe that mergers can and should be a strategic first choice. I think there is a myth out there that they're a last resort.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker F: Yeah.

Speaker C: Like you're running from something instead of towards something. I'm really, really excited to dive into that. Lindsey, what about you?

Speaker F: Yeah, so I am the executive director of the teaching. Well, we are a retention focused organization that work across the country to try and solve the staffing crisis in schools, which is unfortunately the largest we've ever seen it. So um, yeah, we're unapolog trying to keep our, our teachers, our principals, our district leaders in schools in their gifts and able to fight for kids. So that's what I get to do. I think the myth that I am sitting kind of at the edge with and we're working to debunk is that uh, burnout is the default.

Speaker C: Mhm.

Speaker F: And I think about that across the social sector. I think about it for educators, I think about it for nurses, for social workers, for nonprofit staff. Like to me, anyone who's doing good service work, it's kind of expected that we just operate from a place of depletion. And um, I reject that. We're complete with that narrative. We think we can be healthy, wealthy and impactful right here in the social sector space.

Speaker C: There's so much to dive in on that as well. I'm excited. Becky, have a le share to you.

Speaker D: Yep, I'm um, Becky Straw. I'm the co founder of the Adventure Project. We work to support ventures that are working locally in sub Saharan Africa by creating them, creating good jobs. And so that's really focused on helping local organizations thrive that are all doing a social impact lens. So for example, a third of all wells in Africa are currently broken. So instead of drilling more, let's really work to employ people locally as well mechanics so that they can keep them working. And I think what we're really trying to debunk is the idea of aid and prosperity and really giving people the dignity and agency to be the heroes of their own communities versus us coming in and trying to instill what we think we should do instead. We're really trying to work the opposite direction and give people the autonomy to make their own decisions and as I said, be the heroes in their communities.

Speaker C: Yeah, agency is so important in this conversation. Six Degrees is um, like a nonprofit for nonprofits. And I feel like for a long time, uh, nonprofits have been pitted against each other, especially with this kind of lacking of resources and scarcity mindset. And so a lot of our projects bring nonprofits together under, you know, similar Umbrellas and their cause areas to really be a collective force. Um, and so that's why I'm going to start with. When we look at the merger, there is this idea that we have to kind of go at it on our own. And I'd love for you to share a little bit about how you landed at this opportunity, really, and why you said, yeah, I want to join forces, as opposed to what I think a lot of people in the nonprofit space look at as maybe losing a part of yourself, but it's not really framed that way in how you have talked about it. So I'd love for you to just share.

Speaker E: Yeah. So it was, um, just over a year ago last January, that I was invited to a conversation with two other CEOs of global girl organizations to talk about just generally, what does collaboration look like in these times when we see the nonprofit space, um, in turmoil and funding with the political changes, um, the writing on the wall of not just what's happening right now, but what are the repercussions of that going to be for the next generation of girl 10, 20 years from now? And how do we become the strongest organizations we can be, not just to weather the storm, but to be ready for what's around the corner? And honestly, before that conversation, I never even. I, uh, just didn't even know to dream as big of a merger. Like, uh, maybe it's because I'm a CEO who didn't go to business school. It just wasn't something that was introduced to me before. And, um, I think we all came into it with an open mind. And then as, um, with, um, the Girl Rising CEO, Christina Lowery. The great thing is similar to when you started college or you started your first internship. Did anyone ever tell you, look to your left, look to your right, see your peers around you, because you're going to come up the ranks together, and those are going to be the people who are going to help you out one day, or you'll be in positions of power together. It's kind of like that with when you start a nonprofit. Like Becky and I also have known each other since the beginning, and, uh, I had been friends with Christina and Girl Rising since its inception. We came up around the same time, so there was already years of, um, kind of chatting with each other and being a resource and building trust, um, and knowing that we had shared values. Um, so that was ultimately like the first step is, do you share a vision and values with the other organization? And, um, we knew that very clearly. So that would be um, my advice to any leaders who are thinking about this possibility is, um, you know, what organizations do you already know and respect and where can you map complementarity between what you do? And that was really the magic of our partnership. It's not that we don't do exactly the same things. We do complementary things. We have complementary funders. And that created an opportunity to build continuum of support for the girls that we serve.

Speaker C: Yeah, you touched on something there. So many nonprofit leaders are in this space not because they went and got their mba, but because they have lived experience in this field of work. And so like you mentioned, it's like, you know, I didn't take a class to learn all about M and A. So if there's a nonprofit leader that's listening to this conversation, um, and they don't even kind of know where to start, what's kind of one tactical thing that we could leave them with, where they could say, okay, maybe I might explore this a little deeper?

Speaker E: Mhm. Well, it's always a good idea to have a conversation with a board member or a board chair. It was actually my board chair, Tara Abrams, um, is the one who suggested that I talk with the other leaders. Um, so I think that's obvious. You know, you kind of want to be on the same page as your board chair. Um, but then from there, Christina actually had been through a smaller merger with Girl Rising, uh, in the past. So she had, unlike me, she knew it was a possibility. And she had already been thinking about, um, how mergers could be a great way to continue to um, fortify and grow the organization. So it was great, um, to then connect with a leader who um, it wasn't so new to. She had been through it. And actually um, there's a consulting firm that specializes in nonprofit mergers, uh, La Piana Consulting. We didn't work with them, but they wrote the book, like literally the textbook on nonprofit mergers that I read. And they put out, um, a survey that found that um, like 92% of organizations in their sample that had been through a merger considered it a success one year later and would be open to doing a merger again. So even just speaking to organizations that have been through a merger, um, to get their perspective can be really helpful.

Speaker C: That's really great. Thank you so much for sharing. Becky, I'm going to switch over to you. You are taking a traditional global charity model around aid and kind of flipping on its head and creating a lot more agency on the ground. And so I'd love for you to talk a little bit about why being on the ground was so important for you to see kind of the gaps in some of the program working, the way aid was distributed prior.

Speaker D: Yeah, no, that's really a great question. I. Before the Venture Project, I was at Charity Water, and I spent a third of my time in Sub Saharan Africa and Haiti and some of the most remote, hard to reach communities trying to figure out how do we bring them water and sanitation sustainably. And I think for me, what really came out of it was like just listening to what people wanted. And I would always say this, but it's true. Every country I went to, someone would tell me the same thing. They'd say, thank you so much for this Water. I'm wondering if you're hiring, because I really want to work. And that really affected me when I started to hear it over and over again. Um, and if you ask, you know, Gallup did a huge global poll of what's your greatest dream? And they found out that everyone said the same thing, and that was a good job. People have the, uh, deserve the dignity of work. And I think we have this myth that because you are living in extreme poverty, you need our help, when in actuality, people sometimes know what to do. They're just lacking capital or lacking resources to be able to take care of their own families. So we wanted to bridge that gap and give that to them.

Speaker C: Yeah, you're touching on sustainability, right? Like, how do you then create some infrastructure after the aid has been deployed the first time? And when we first met, I talked a little about, um, a prior life when I was, uh, expanding EV infrastructure across the country. And, um, in those early days, everything was breaking down and no one had been trained locally in the communities how to quickly fix it. So you were, you know, having to go to these national organizations and trying to deploy techs to get to these areas, and it just didn't work. Yeah, right. And so you have people that are ready and willing in these communities. So I just, I really do love that model. And you have also done something that can be perceived as risky, but at, uh, 6 degrees. We think it's really important. You said we're going to double down here on things like storytelling and marketing so that people can kind of connect with your organization in a deeper way and what you all are doing. Can you talk a little bit about why you did that and what were the signs that made you say, yes, it's worth it and we're going to commit in that way?

Speaker D: I think for us, at least professionally, 2025 was really hard, especially for international nonprofits. Many of us know the dismantling of USAID created a huge gap in funding and a lot of uncertainty. And so for us, it was really, we got together as a team and we're like, well, what if we don't invest in this? Then we're really going to have a problem. So I think one of our best investments was hiring a chief development officer, uh, in the spring, who's been phenomenal at just doubling down on talking to our donors, bringing them along, educating them about what we're doing and where we're going, and helping us create a really great framework and strategy to be like, nope, we're going to double the number of local partners we work with this year, and here's why. And we're really on a great roadmap, which has been really successful and it's awesome to see. But, you know, in that vein, it's like really supporting the storytelling and allowing us to share more stories, allowing us to hire, um, we have a team in Rwanda who, you know, captures the content. And so helping them share out the story more helps just raise more awareness because I think we really need to show the solutions and really need to show that things are working and that we're not just going to slowly back away and hide. Right. Like, now is the time. We really need hope and help.

Speaker C: Yeah, that's a great segue. Um, those that know you, Lindsay, know that you lead very boldly, unapologetically. Your work is very human centered. And so I'd love for you to share a little bit about why it is critically important for you to continue to lead in that way and to not compromise those values.

Speaker F: I really appreciate the question and I want to, you know, speak to some of the duality because there are very real fears, there are safety concerns. We know so many organizations who had equity focused, mission driven kind of organization that were scrubbing their websites, that were really concerned about their social media, that were really nervous about whether they could name their pronouns or their racial identities. Right. And so we saw this kind of collabor collective scrubbing and shifting away from identity. But I see identity as asset. I see identity as liberation. And I believe deeply in the Ghanaian principle of Sankofa, of looking back to move forward, like, we don't build a better future while ignoring our history. And so for me, um, a couple things are true. One is that our ancestors didn't get to sit on the sidelines. For many of us, our ancestors were change leaders. They said something, they did something, they took Action. And we get to do that too. That is our responsibility in this generation to make sure that we're not regressing as a community. You know, with the consent of my team, we really took uh, a stance of we're not going to invisibilize the fact that our mission is really centered on retaining educators and specifically educators of color, bipoc educators. Because research shows that every child benefits from a black teacher regardless of the child's race. This is research and we are not going to erase facts. Sorry y'. All. We are teachers at the teaching. Well, we believe in research, in data, in facts and in science and all the things that we've invested in as a collective. So um, to me, yeah, it's what we've learned from our ancestors. It's making sure that we take a people first approach. And I also recognize that I want to model for my daughters and for educators everywhere that uh, we get to heal out loud, we get to be proud about who we are, we get to build coalition, um, and we're going to re dignify the profession with an identity forward lens.

Speaker C: You're amazing. Uh, so I'd love for you to talk a little bit about retaining funders and the success that you've had, which is astonishing and incredibly, um, I think empowering for people to kind of hear about.

Speaker F: Yeah, I, uh, we are very grateful to have amazing, uh, philanthropic partners. We have retained 100% of our funders for three consecutive years while adding new funders. And what I'll say is it's so critical that we find our people in philanthropy. Right. And once we do, we're gonna ask them to make warm intros. I find that the more authentic and honest I am with funders and this is the scary part. So if you're running an org, girl, uh, I know DM me on LinkedIn. It is scary, but the more honest and transparent I am. $50,000 with a 20 page report is not going to be sustainable for my team. No. I cannot fix the largest staffing crisis in all of history in 18 months. It's going to require six figure, multi year unrestricted trust based philanthropy to actually form solutions that are here long term. The education space has taken this long to get dysregulated. We're going to need to do more than co regulating. We're going to need to resource with capital and I need to know that my funders are here to stay in the fight to resource my team and to unlock new opportunities. And so I find that treating our funders as partners, as an extension of our team, inviting them into the work, not doing the, you know, bureaucratic updates and the cute pictures. I'm talking about something really stressful is happening in the school district. Right. And, like, I think you care because you're a place based funder. I want to lift the veil and invite you into being a part of the solution. And by the way, an additional 100k would go a long way at X project, right?

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker F: To me, they are just an extension of my team. And I encourage others to, to be honest about what you need, um, and to stand in your power, because we're. We're on our way.

Speaker C: It's fantastic. Last week I was speaking at a conference with just women, and I talked about this idea of comfort. And I think as people, we tend to look at comfort as something that we, we need to earn or it's like the end goal.

Speaker E: Right.

Speaker C: Like, once we climb this big mountain, we get to the top and like, comfort is our rest. And I think in the nonprofit space, we. We need that. Like, you know, um, but I also believe that comfort can be a sign of complacency. And sometimes comfort is that signal that maybe we're not doing enough or we've been doing things well for a while, but it's time to kind of amp it up. Right. Um, good work doesn't always mean that we just stay with the status quo. And so each of you have leaned in and done things that I feel like are uncomfortable for many nonprofit leaders. And so I'd love to kind of make this kind of a round robin question where you can each share. What was that sign of discomfort that made, you know, that you had to take that next step towards, you know, more progressive action, if you will.

Speaker D: Why don't we start with you?

Speaker E: Um, well, Lindsay, what you shared kind of, um, is jiving with some reflections I had on, um, as I prepared to tell our donors about the merger. So, um, we decided to go under the. Have a unified name as Girl Rising. Um, and we're rebranding Girl Rising. You're gonna see the infusion of she's the first in the new website and new branding. Um, but at first it was, um, scary for me to prepare to talk to donors and funders because I thought they might just be really emotional about the change and, um, decide that they were done or walk away. And all these irrational fears started to build up. And in the end, when we presented why we were doing this merger, how it, you know, we led with our mission, with our Values with what it would achieve, the scale that we would have together. Not a single donor or funder questioned it or even, like, none of those fears materialized.

Speaker C: Yeah, it's fantastic.

Speaker E: Yeah. And, um, I was so, like, delightfully surprised in a way. But it's such a reminder that if you really, you're cultivating this community of supporters, um, who share your values, they're going to be instantly excited by the opportunity to have a deeper impact and things like, um, logos, all that. That's. It's not the most important thing.

Speaker C: And you find that you're probably more tied to it, your staff. Right. I think that that's sometimes our branding. Right. We can get tied to that idea when our donors, our supporters, are seeing us being better stewards of the resources that they're entrusting us with as well. Um, so that's really powerful. Thanks for sharing. Uh, Becky, how about you?

Speaker D: Gosh, I need to think, but I. I lack the safety gene, maybe, and maybe that's like, a fault of mine,

Speaker C: like the free solo gene or what the.

Speaker F: You know, me too.

Speaker D: Uh, like, you know, I just think now that I'm 45, but started when I was in my 20s, it's like, we just didn't take salaries for a year and a half. I just trusted and had faith that I slept on people's couches for almost a year, you know, just bouncing around New York to make it happen. And what I learned from that experience was actually in, like, letting go and having fear, not, you know, having the courage to. To live without fear. I realized the fear was all in my head, if that made sense. Instead, everyone opened their door to. They wanted to be part of that story. And so to your point about transparency, it's like, you tell people, this is hard. Like, this is what I'm working on. This is how I'm doing. People want to come along and they want to see you excel. Like, they want that for you because they can see the change that the organization is making. So the more that you're sharing out, the actually easier it is. And it sounds counterintuitive, but kind of the crazier you get. People are like, I'm here for that. You know, uh, and it really. It is. I have those same fearful moments where I'm always going, like, oh, my gosh, when is somebody going to, like, open my door and be like, like, we figured it out. Like, you know, at these. I'm just a fraud. Or, you know, moments like, yeah, the imposter syndrome.

Speaker E: Imposter syndrome.

Speaker D: It doesn't yeah, yeah. Doesn't exist.

Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. And I think people respect bravery and they want to be brave. And so we have an attraction to, want to support those that are being vulnerable and brave and stepping out and doing things a different way. Um, so.

Speaker D: And it's contagious. I'm hearing you. And I'm like, yeah, I know, tampered.

Speaker E: Right.

Speaker D: I need. Yeah, we got this.

Speaker F: I think there's a common thread though. Right. Because um, so much of what can get in the way is our own inner limiting beliefs. And so I'm like, every leader needs a therapist, every leader needs a coach. Uh, everybody needs to figure out their healing modalities. This social impact work is both incredibly rewarding and also exceptionally extractive in many ways. Right. And so how are you continuing to resource yourself? I think when you say that for me, I think about my three daughters and I'm um, not someone that like loves a legacy prompt. But I am really interested in living my values in every decision. And what I've found is that my leadership is more effective, our outcomes are stronger. Um, we end up getting increasing followers and believers and movement makers when we build systems around our values and not the other way around. Like to me it just becomes easier to implement, um, when you truly believe but also are in your authentic state. And so I would just continue to tell people, like, get out of your own way, surround yourself with champions.

Speaker C: Mhm.

Speaker F: The people that are going to say that was horrific because I have those people. And also the people that are like, you're being too hard on yourself. You know, steward your energy, move forward, keep going. Our tribes matter. And so yeah, put the good people in your circle.

Speaker C: Yeah. And I mean that really ties into kind of how we want to put a cherry on top of this conversation. You know, the team at we are for Good really loves a one good thing. And we've talked about, uh, one maybe one plus bad year. It's been a hard year. Um, it's been difficult. And I think that like you said it perfectly, Lindsay. Um, it can be extracting the work. Right. And it's like one of my daughters, I have two little girls as well and they have this book about filling the cup. Um, and so we talk about that a lot. Um, and being leaders in this space. You have teams that are looking to you and relying on you. And so I'd love for us to talk a little bit about the kind of, the one good thing that we are trying to implement with our teams in and around kind of that self care um, piece. And, you know, I can share first because I really had this reckoning last year. You know, I. I had to take a couple weeks off where I said, I'm going to trust that everything will not burn and fall apart around me. And I think that I'm the first person to look at a team member and say, hey, you seem homesick. I want you to take the week off and go fly home and see, you know, your, your parents or your family, um, they're like, oh, no, that's like right before this campaign we're supposed to. It's like, you have to do it now because we're. You're going to need to be filled up in order to get through that next stretch. But, um, it was harder for me to do it. And what I learned is that when I modeled made it a lot easier for my team to say, hey, this is what I need. Can I. I need to clock out a, uh, two today, because I just, like, I'm having a hard mental health day and creating those spaces so that you can give your best, especially when it's needed, but also take care of one another. So, um, anybody that feels, you know, led to go first. Please share. What's your one good thing?

Speaker D: I could share what we did a few weeks ago, which was really transformative because I came from Charity Water, which was an incredible organization that worked. I always worked 60 to 80 hours a week for years. Right. So it was hard for me. But I started to talk to my team. I have my COO in Minneapolis, like, going through a lot. Like I said, we all did really well. We had a great, epic holiday. We need to step back and have a quiet week. Which chat GDP told me what it was. Cause I didn't even know what quiet week was. It recommended it, and I was like, this is beautiful. And it was just like you stepped back from all your internal meetings and you just do the deep work you want to do. You get your stuff done. Personally, my kids destroyed my basement over the holidays. And I was like, I just need a few hours to like, shovel toys off the floor. But I needed that, like, to mentally just reset. And it was a beautiful thing. Everybody did something different, but we still did our work. But we were able to step away from some of the routine meetings to kind of reset.

Speaker C: That was great.

Speaker E: Well, I love that notion of just finding time to think and, uh, ask yourself the hard questions. And then after you do that soul searching, just trust your instinct and listen to that inner voice. So during the merger process, for example, I asked myself, if millions of dollars dropped from the sky, would I still want to do this merger? And the answer was so clearly yes. Like, this is about becoming a stronger force by joining with an organization that has different strengths than we do. And it's not about the numbers on the financial statement at the moment. It's about what we're building together. And then, um, I haven't told the story publicly yet, but at the end, in December of last year, uh, well, actually it was a couple months before I received, um, a letter in my office. It was, uh, from a law firm in New Mexico, Lagasque. It was a woman who passed away her will and she left 50% of her estate to. She's the first. And 50% to a local organization in New Mexico. And then those funds came through in December. And it was the largest single gift that she's the first had ever received from a total stranger. This woman never contacted me or gave in her lifetime. And, um, it put us in an even stronger position. And I went back to that question I asked myself. And it kind of like that impossible dream happened. Money fell from the sky. And I was so thrilled that we were bringing it into this merged entity and that it gives us the security to like really execute on this dream that we created together. With Girl Rising, that is the best story.

Speaker C: I mean, it's serendipitous, but it's also really not. It's going back to what we've talked about today, which is like aligning your values, living your values, and people responding to that. Because often we talk six degrees. We talk about ripples going out and you don't always know, you know, who is being impacted by those ripples. And then it swung back and you got to see that impact. That's incredible. Thanks for sharing.

Speaker E: Thanks.

Speaker C: You want to close us out?

Speaker F: Yeah. I was just kind of manifesting that a large amount of money was going to fall out of the sky. Did you also do that? I had conversion for you. I had pleasure for your joy.

Speaker C: Thank you.

Speaker F: That was amazing. Yeah, I mean, so we definitely invest in self care. But I'll say I'm going to flip your question a little bit because we are more deeply investing in collective care at the teaching. Well, right. Everyone does get their $150 a month for their wellness stipend. That is in the budget and it is held sacred. But for us, we really invest in collective spaces. Like we stay resourced in community. We know that especially as a global majority organization, many of us, culturally, like you, source from big family events and the big dinner on Sunday night and your big church gatherings, whatever it is. And so we do three hours a week of internal PDF and we have a funder who pays for that because those are billable hours. So when we talk about funders, I am very explicit with my funders. I also need internal funds for capacitation. Um, every six months, we live together for a full week as a team.

Speaker C: Every six months.

Speaker F: Every six months. So twice a week, kind of at a giant house. The entire teaching. Well, team, we live together for an entire week.

Speaker C: I love it.

Speaker F: Twice a year. We don't go longer than six months. Um, that is paid for by a funder. We also do leadership step backs. So I have begun to. And I saw in the chat, I see you over there, someone asked, like, how do you practice, Julius, how you cue us up? How do you practice, um, bravery to be honest and transparent with your funders? That's a question that came through right there. And I'll just say, like, to me, funders are just other humans. I don't. I don't idolize. I don't. You're not a hero. You are a do gooder with a larger wallet. And so if you're my people, you're my people. And I find that people in philanthropy want to be humanized. They don't want to be worshiped. They want to be brought in on the work. And so when I tell them, like, this is what's going to be needed to actualize the work and this is behind the scenes, I don't talk about overhead. Hm. I'm not doing that. 89% of what we spend is on our people. Right. So some of what you give as your grant is going to need to go towards my people because the mission doesn't live and our impact isn't actualized if my people are burnt out. It's just that simple. We can't hold teachers in their most vulnerable moments if my staff is emotionally unstable. M. And so it's the collective spaces we're pouring into. Sure, there's self care, but there's a lot of collective care going on at the teaching.

Speaker C: This is such an incredible conversation. If you're listening, I just want to thank all of our panelists for their honesty, their leadership, and just willingness to show up and to be vulnerable and to share your nuggets. Right. Because I think that would better collectively.

Speaker B: Hey, friend. Thank you so much for joining us today. If you find yourself looking for a place to stay connected and keep learning between episodes I hope you'll come and join us inside the we are for Good community. Yeah, it is free. It's full of incredible non profit leaders like yourself and it's now an app in the Apple App Store and Google Play Store. So you can take this community with you wherever you go. Head over to weareforgoodcommunity.com to find us. We cannot wait to see you inside.