S3E3 Retail Transformers - Jeffrey P. McNulty - New Retail Ethos

Speaker A: 3, 2, 1.

Speaker B: You're listening to the Retail Razor show where your expert hosts and their guests cut through the clutter in retail and retail tech to shape the future of retail.

Speaker C: Hello and welcome to season three, episode three of the Retail Razor show. I'm, um, your host, Ricardo Belmar.

Speaker A: And I'm your co host, Kasey Golden. Welcome to retail's favorite podcast for product junkies, commerce technologists and everyone else in between retail and retail tech.

Speaker C: Today. As part of our back to basics of retailing theme this season, we are examining an incredibly important and often underrated aspect of retail successful leadership. What makes a great retail leader, especially during constrained times like retailers are in this year we'll be meeting our latest retail transformer, Jeffrey McNulty, founder and CEO of, uh, New retail ethos consultancy. We'll learn from Jeffrey's 30 Years of Hands on industry experience as an executive leader for the Home Depot, Lowe's, Barnes Noble, Petsmart, Shopco, Toys R Us, Publix and Festival foods. Plus his 18 years of experience as a retail research analyst. Are you excited yet?

Speaker A: I'm a big fan of this episode. This is such an underrated topic. We've touched on, um, parts of it before with our retail transformer back in gosh season, season one, episode nine. If I'm correct, that was April sequel and a few times relating to managing store teams and frontline workers with Ron Thurston back in the first two episodes of the podcast. But how do you develop retail leadership and how do you develop these leaders into executives? I think that how those leaders are shaped the success of creates a success for the entire organization. And what qualities do they need to be able to create this type of a success story?

Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. I mean, that's exactly what we're diving into today. Our conversation with Jeffrey will look at what he's learned from his retail career path, what he's learned from other successful retail leaders, and how that's helped him develop this extensive training program and framework for developing those great retail leaders that lead these successful retail organizations. We'll see just how a, uh, strong retail business begins with the right leadership qualities.

Speaker A: I'm sure our listeners and viewers will come away with learning exactly why Jeff McNulty is more than meets the eye.

Speaker C: He stole my line again.

Speaker A: That was definitely on purpose.

Speaker C: I know, I know. I'm gonna watch for that next time. All right, so let's move on now and meet our newest retail transformer, Jeffrey McNulty, former retail leader, industry analyst, author of the Ultimate Retail Manual, and now founder And CEO of uh, new retail ethos consultancy. See. Welcome M to the show, Jeffrey. I'm so excited we are finally having this discussion.

Speaker A: Yes, thrilled we're having you on the show. Retail leadership is an overlooked topic that just doesn't get enough attention that it needs. We're always coming back to the point on the show that in retail, no matter how much tech you throw at it, it's still a people business. It's about those human relationships and that absolutely starts with the leaders in every retail brand and the floor.

Speaker B: Yeah, I'm honored to be here actually. So thank you guys for, for uh, having me on your show. I know you guys have a lot of top tier talent on the show. I see you guys interviewing a lot of the top tier retail leaders or around the world actually. So I'm really a big fan of the show and I uh, try to engage as much as I can. You guys record some really good stuff. So I'm honored to be here.

Speaker C: Oh, well, thanks. Thank you for that, Jeffrey. Absolutely.

Speaker B: Yeah. You're welcome.

Speaker A: So Jeffrey, why don't we just jump in by having you introduce yourself, share some of your retail background just to get us started.

Speaker B: Okay. For those that don't know me, my name is Jeffrey P. McNulty and I'm a. I'm the founder and CEO of New Retail ethos consultancy. I'm also a retail business turnaround expert, a retail business educator and trainer, a leadership coach, innovator, online course creator of the ultimate retail courses, speaker and bestselling author of the ultimate retail manual. My, my clients and colleagues have kind of nicknamed me a hybrid in the business world because I have 30 years of experience as an executive leader for the Home Depot, Lowe's, Barnes and Noble, Shopco, Petsmart, Toys R Us. I'll make sure I get all of them. Publix and festival foods, as well as over 18 years experience as a retail analyst. And throughout my uh, my tenure I've conducted over 1000 consultations slash engagements with clients on Wall Street, Hedge fund managers, equity investment partners, retailers, from niche players to big box business owners and entrepreneurs on the retail sector. So definitely been around the block a little bit. Thoroughly. Thoroughly enjoy retail. Love it. Like uh, I said, spent 30 years in the sector, hands on with those eight different retailers. And I will always be a positive voice and advocate for the retail sector. I love everybody in retail. I have admiration and respect for what they're going through, especially after the pandemic that was unprecedented and what they went through. But the silver lining is the frontline employees really got recognized for how important they are to, to every brand. So I was really happy to see that. As you know, when I post on LinkedIn, it's always positive about retail just because I, I care about the sector and I always will.

Speaker C: Yeah, that is an amazing background. And I, uh, I know I, I, for one, am always a fan. I, I, I love the positivity that you bring to all these topics in retail because like Kasey said at the beginning, this always, uh, feels. Although we talk about it a lot on, on our show, we try to really highlight aspects of retail leadership, especially on Frontline teams, but it just seems like it doesn't get enough attention. Although I completely agree with you that since the pandemic, if there's a silver lining, it's that we finally did shine a light on all of the people in those roles and what they're doing and why it's so important not just to the retail business, but to all of us, right, as consumers. So let's dive in a little bit more into, you know, your retail experiences. And you've got, you've been at so many brands and so many different roles and how that led you to create new retail ethos and how you work with retailers and retail businesses.

Speaker B: Yeah, that's a great question. I actually got into consulting back in 2005. I was still heavily involved in retail. I think it was a store manager at PetSmart at the time, and Gearson Lehman Group was the largest consulting firm in the world. They reached out to me and asked me if I wanted to be a retail consultant for them. So I decided to join with them. And I, uh, was recognized very, very early on because I was able to communicate diverse concepts to different audiences. I could relay the information to, to a hedge fund manager or an executive at a, uh, at a retailer or a business. You know, it's, you change the vernacular a little bit and everything like that, but I was able to communicate those ideas. And then in 2018, I thought, you know what, let me, let me go ahead and branch out on my own. I really enjoyed doing this. I started building up a nice client base, a global client base, which was really nice. Outside of Gearson Lehman Group, of course, that would be a conflict of interest. So New Retail Ethos is a, is a retail business and management consultancy that assists retail organizations, retail leaders, businesses, regardless of size, scope and niche, uh, founders, CEOs, uh, human resource managers, entrepreneurs, and intrapreneurs. A lot of people don't really know what intrapreneurs are. But I work a lot with those in, in businesses that they're working in or retailers and I help them with alleviating and addressing common pain points. So we provide all facets of retail consulting, anticipatory intelligence, instructional programs and pragmatic delivery of retail concepts while working with our clients to fulfill their vision and aspirations. We offer what I call bespoke advisory services to retail and business leaders around the world. We create a structured blueprint that assists clients with achieving sustained success. In air quotes, sustained success is what we're looking for. Through my proprietary program that I created, we provide a comprehensive assessment of each retailer or uh, business which encompasses all 10 pillars contained within my online course the Ultimate Retail Course and of course my best selling book the Ultimate Retail Manual. And we provide tangible and actionable solutions. So as a founder and CEO I thoroughly enjoy being ground engaged with our clients by providing a personalized experience that I'm extremely proud of. I know during the pandemic it was hard to get out there as much into the stores, into the businesses, but complete client satisfaction is our number one priority. I know a lot of people say that but I like to under promise and over deliver with each client that we have. I have clients that I've worked with now for 15 years data repeat clients that coming back and that to me is, is, is, is really, it's surreal that that I'm able to do that, help these people. It makes me feel good every night when I go to bed. So for more information on my retail and business and online courses and the book you can go to the ultimate retailcourse.com and for consulting services you can visit my website@newretailethos.com Fantastic.

Speaker C: So let's tell us a little bit more about the intrapreneurship you mentioned. And I, I, I focus on that one because that's not something we end up talking a lot about in retail. It's a, it's a, I, I think uh, a fairly interesting and has become a much more common concept in business but you don't often hear retailers talking about that in their organization. So tell us a little bit more about what you do with retailers there.

Speaker B: Yeah, that's, that's a great point you bring up. That's why if you notice I've been posting about a lot of that on LinkedIn lately.

Speaker C: Yeah, yeah.

Speaker B: Entrepreneurs are basically entrepreneurs that are working inside the structure and confines of a business structure already. So they don't have to worry about the funding and they don't have to worry about all the other struggles, you know, the four levels that each business goes through from startup to, to growth and stuff like that. So they have the safety net of the resources there, the structure's already in place and then they, if they're provided autonomy, which we could spend an entire conversation on just that one topic and we will in the future. You have a bunch of raving fans that are creating innovative ideas in your company. And what's really awesome is the employee engagement skyrockets because the employee feels like they're actually a part of the business. They feel like they're an actual business owner of the business. And if you ever look at employee, uh, businesses that are employee owned, like there's a lot of grocery stores out here in Wisconsin where I live, that are employee owned. They, that the engagements through the roof, the customer service is phenomenal. Everybody seems to be happy, they're in a good mood, stuff like that. So it's really an awesome thing to do. But you gotta have, you gotta have leaders at the very top that, that are, uh, gonna provide that structure again. Of course, you know, you can't have entrepreneurs going around and running, running havoc and causing problems and just doing whatever they want. There has to be some structure in place and protocols. But you know, the best I, some of the best ideas I ever had when I was in retail didn't come from myself. They came from an army of entrepreneurs that I, that I empowered. Uh, and I embraced, giving them the autonomy and the freedom to experiment with certain things. I share a lot of these examples that I actually was able to achieve myself personally because I was afforded that opportunity to be an entrepreneur. And I was given a really, really healthy dose of autonomy where I could try things. If I made a mistake, I learned from it. I wasn't, I wasn't penalized and humiliated and insulted. And so when you create that energy, it's a very, very positive energy that permeates throughout an entire store or a business. But you have to have leaders that really understand that topic. And if, if they don't, if they, if their fear of lack of control, it's not going to work because the employee has to feel like, hey, you know what, I got a great idea here. Like, here's a great example. When I was at Home Depot as a, uh, district manager in training at the store in Green Bay, Wisconsin, I kept getting a lot of requests for Gorilla Glue. And I went to my old, my president of the entire Midwest division of 350 stores. His name was Bill Patterson. And I said, bill, I Want to go ahead and pilot this, I want to run this. I don't need any extra hours, any extra resources, but I want to, I want to pilot these SKUs and I'll, I'll give you all the feedback and all the uh, detailed financial information from it. So a month later they rolled out four SKUs of Gorilla Glue to the Midwest division and then ultimately to the entire company. So when you walk into Home Depot and see Gorilla Glue, I'm really proud that I was the one that implemented and started to get that into the company. Because if I didn't have that kind of entrepreneurship that I was afforded in that autonomy, that would have never happened.

Speaker C: And I can definitely tell you as a Home Depot customer, I appreciate that you did that because I've bought Gorilla Glue there many a time.

Speaker A: I have to um. Oh my gosh, did you see that girl put Gorilla Glue in her hair? Anyway,

Speaker B: where's my royalties for that?

Speaker A: Uh, you know you said something where you said you were allowed to have some autonomy and make mistakes. So you just. Without getting X, which just gave me massive flashbacks. That was not my experience when I started, which I think is phenomenal. Just to kind of go back into your early days, what, how did you get into retail and what was that moment? Because I know, I remember my moment of when you decided, I'm never leaving. Like this is going a career, it's not necessarily a job.

Speaker B: Well, first of all, how long's the show? I love to talk about this topic

Speaker A: because I'm uh, not that like first, your first, the first job and the first moment where you're just like, I think I found my thing.

Speaker B: Well mine didn't actually work that way, but I'll kind of give you the chronological progression, how it worked. I started in retail in 1982 in Sunrise, Florida which is a suburb of Fort Lauderdale at Ah, public supermarkets as a part time bag boy. And I was earning a whopping 202 and 90 cents an hour. So I was, I was rocking, I was, I was, I was loaded. I was, that was more money in the world. I was driving my uh, more money

Speaker A: than I was, I was riding my

Speaker B: 10 speed bike to work in the hot weather. I didn't care. And I was going out in the hot weather and putting the groceries in the car. But at that point it was just my, my grandmother actually got me the job. I was, I was 15 years old, I was going to Piper High School in Sunrise and my grandmother said, okay, it's time for you to get a part time Job. She went down to the local public supermarket, walked right up to the store manager, said, hey, I got a, I got a, I got, uh, a grandson. He's 15 years old. He needs a job. Let's get him hired. And sure enough, the guy goes, let's get him in here. So I was hired the next day. It, uh, I had no intention of having a tenured career in the retail sector. To me, that was my first job. But serendipitously, I had an epiphany in 1991. I joined Home Depot in 1991. And that, that is, uh, that is where I started thinking about having a career in retail. And I started at the Deer Farrell Beach, Florida store, which is about five minutes. Bernie Marcus, the CEO of Home Depot at the time, lived five miles away in Boca Raton. It was in our store about four or five times a month. And, uh, you know, I was captivated and enthralled by his exemplary leadership and passion for helping people. I've never met anybody even close that had his passion for helping people. I mean, he was obsessive, over the top in a good way. And he was fiercely devoted to complete customer satisfaction. And I could tell you some stories about satisfaction. I remember one time I was out of a electrical outlet and a customer came in and wanted, you know, a couple 10 packs to finish a job. He said, you drive to whatever store it takes, you get it and you drive it to their house and you thank them for their business. I'm like, yes, sir, you got it. What else? Drop down, give you 20, whatever you need, you got it. You know, he was a very motivational guy and, and I share some stories in the book and in the courses with him as well. But so at, at that point, I, I soon found myself kind of envisioning a, uh, having a long retail career because of him. Now in that store, Arthur Blank was in there. Ron Brill, Pat Farah, uh, I mean, the five co founders of Home Depot were in that store. It was a very small store. It was about 80,000 square feet, and on a Saturday, you'd have to spend about 15 minutes driving around the parking lot trying to find a place to park because it was so busy and it was crazy. I mean, you leave your house a half hour early and you're driving around trying to find a place to park. But as a quick side note, before I joined Home Depot, I applied to be a police officer with the Broward Sheriff's office in 1991, that same year before I joined them. And the Gulf War started that year and the force enacted a hiring freeze. So my seminal moment actually happened at the end of 1991, six months into my Home Depot career, when the Broward Sheriff office offered me an opportunity to join the force. And the compensation was double my salary. They had an awesome pension and excellent benefits. So I said, well, I gotta, uh, I got a decision to make. So what I do when I have tough decisions, I give myself a timeline. It's usually 24 hours, unless it's something that's much, much more entailed. So I go home and I, I, I turn my lights off, I put on the egg timer for an hour and I said, okay, let's, let's do the pros and cons. Close my eyes. And I said, you know what? I, I really think I want to, I wanna think I wanna do this Home Depot thing. So I was really torn though, because many of my, my, uh, workout partners from Gold's Gym, there was captains and lieutenants in there and a lot of my school classmates were, were police officers. And I really wanted to, uh, to protect and serve. But after an intense, intense soul searching session, I finally decided to turn down their offer and focus my efforts on becoming the best servant leader that I could be. Now, I won't lie to you that, that next six months, when the paycheck was coming in, you were thinking, well, you know, I mean, look good, you know, you can get a good police. I have to cut my hair. I had really long hair back then. I tried to grow a ponytail because I was watching Miami Vice and uh, and Don Johnson when he, he became bad Crockett. He had a ponytail, so.

Speaker C: That's right, yeah, I had a mini

Speaker B: mullet going on and they said, yeah, you're gonna have to, you're gonna have to get the, you know, the crew cut or whatever. So. But yeah, it was, it was a tough decision. For about six months, I kind of second guessed myself a little bit. But I, I just kept seeing the, the way that Bernie and all the executive leaders were leading by example. Like you, you'd walk into receiving and you'd see a, uh, you know, Bernie Marcus sweeping receiving, you know, or, or pushing carts. And I'm like, you know, uh, you can't beat that. You, you can't beat leading by example. And I remembered that every step I went up the ladder. I always remembered that. And that was my greatest strength, was leading by example. But that's, that's kind of how my story went. It's a little bit off the Beaten path?

Speaker A: No, I mean, I think that I've hear. I've heard a lot of these stories and I, I think you're familiar with Ron Thurston, who we've also had on the show a few times, and, and he talks about these stories and everybody who works in this industry loves product. We're pro. We're all product junkies. But at the end of the day, the moment was because of him. A her, a person. It was one person that may essentially spearheaded that decision that this is what I want to do and this is where I want to be. And I think it just kind of runs full circle to why retail leadership is so incredibly important. Because those. It creates the sparks for the future. Right. You know, because it wasn't I want to work in retail because I want to sell dresses. It was because somebody I worked with made that impact, that impression that said, this will be the rest of my life and I want to learn from them, you know, and I think that if we don't keep doing these types of programming and leadership development, it's going to. Has that domino effect. So I just find it very interesting. Everybody kind of comes back to a person that had great retail leadership that guided.

Speaker C: Yeah. And I think, you know, one of. When I look at one of the ways where I've seen and read a lot of the things that you like to talk about, uh, Jeffrey, particularly with the things you post on LinkedIn and what you. Some m. Of the things you say in your book, one of the things I would really love to know. I mean, what was one of the main driving factors, what really kind of made you think I, I need to put all this down into a book? And how, uh, you came up with the ultimate retail manual. What was that impetus that you had that really motivated you to do that?

Speaker B: That. That's another long story. But I'm gonna, I'll try to keep it short. I'm gonna try to keep it short because this is really a. A fantastic story. But throughout my early leadership career at in Publix and Home Depot, I wanted to read one book that contained a amalgamation of concepts that would assist me in becoming a better salesperson, excuse me, motivator, coach, merchandiser, and mentor and leader. However, there wasn't one retail book that contained all this information. It wasn't available. So I'm a voracious reader. I love to learn and grow. So at the time, I was purchasing a plethora of books that were specifically focused on one major segment, I think of like, leadership coaching. Merchandising sales, human resources, et cetera. And I was, I'm, I'm still amazed that 26 years later after that, there was still wasn't one book that covered all this material that I think a, uh, retail employee or a business employee should, should have. So I was like, wow. I, you know, when, when I started thinking about writing the book in early 2017. Now, obviously the book's been updated like 12 different times since then. I try to update it every year to keep it fresh. But I said, you know, there's got to be a book available now. It's been 20, 26ish years, and there still wasn't a book. And I'm like, well, the axiom, um, that kind of came to mind was if you can't find what you're looking for, create it. So I started reaching out to some, some people on LinkedIn that wrote books, and, and, and a lot of my colleagues and friends and family and clients were like, Jeff, you got a lot of really good, tangible knowledge that you have, and you, you, you have it in a unique way because you've worked for so many different retailers where you, if you work at one retailer your whole life, you're, you're gonna miss out on some of the other nuances of the different products and the different seasonalities and stuff like that. So I, I pretty much worked in almost every major sector that, that's in retail. And I thought, well, isn't it kind of hard to write a book? And, and it's not easy. It took me 17 months, but I finally, I, I, I set a goal of 18 months, so I beat it by a month. But that's exactly what I did. It, it, it, like I said. But it took me about four years of people saying this to me, because when your friends and family tell you something, they're just being supportive and being nice. And, but then I started. I was going back to, to, uh, UWG here, University of Wisconsin, Green Bay, to finish up my degree, and I'd have PhD professors like Jeff. You write really well. You, you could be teaching this class by now with what you know, and, and they leaned on me for some of the extracurricular activities and stuff like that. Then I started having clients that were saying this. I thought, you know, maybe there's something to this. But I wanted to make sure that I wrote a book that, that came from Empirical results versus theoretical ideas. I've read many, many books, and they tell you the solution, but they don't show you how to implement the strategies and, and, and how to achieve the desired results. So this manual is a hands on guide that walks you through each pillar slash strategy while providing tangible methodologies uh, to achieve success. So I personally lived and executed there's, it's, there's 10 pillars contained within the, the book and then of course the, the course. And I, I, I created these, most of these pillars when I was at Home Depot because it was the hardest retail job I ever had. In fact, uh, uh, there was one time I thought about leaving. It was so intense. The first year I was a store manager. I mean you're, you're getting inundated with now, now back then you were responsible as an executive leader for three, 400 employees, 60 to $80 million business. And you were responsible for all of the special orders, the installations and the delivery issues. And that's where 90% of your issues came from. So I enjoyed when a customer had a problem. It had something to do with the store because I could easily fix it. So I was really challenged that first year. Took me about a year to get my legs under me. And I'm a passionate, outgoing person. I love people, I love to get to know people. So I said Jeff, when you write this book, make sure you write it from a hands on perspective. So I share a myriad of tangible and poignant strategies that truly encapsulate how to achieve your retail and business aspirations. So when the 10 pillar proprietary system that I created, which is portable and reproducible, is executed consistently, that's the key word there that you got to execute it consistently. You can't just pick and choose the pillars you want to implement. It is a proven blueprint for achieving sustained retail and business success. So I have clients that, that have been using it for three or four years and they're like Jeff, you know, I keep coming back to the talent acquisition piece even though that we've improved our onboarding process and all that. So the 10 pillars are micro, micro vertical some people like to call them contained within the manual. Therefore any I have human resource professionals that use the book. I have retail employees and leaders from entry level up to the C suite. Executive founders, CEOs, business owners, entrepreneurs, entrepreneurs and and lately a lot of college students, high school students and retail interns. So each pillar, I like to say each pillar accurately conveys a uh, functional strategy that contributes to the overall successful synergistic effect of, of, of the blueprint. So, and it's surreal to see readers in 23 different countries resonating with the manual. You know, when I first wrote the manual, I thought, wow, it'd be nice if I could pick up a couple countries. But Mexico has been jamming lately and a lot of these.

Speaker C: Wow.

Speaker B: A lot of these countries, their English is not their first language. And my book is not translated into another language as of yet. As of yet. I'm starting to think about going, uh, that down the road now. But it's surreal when you wake up and realize that when, when Bernie did what he did for me. That's why I give back so much on, uh, LinkedIn. A lot of my posts, I share free information that I charge for with clients. I don't give away the whole kitchen sink, but I definitely give you enough to get you going. And I do that because I'm grateful for when you have five co founders of Home Depot not teaching you personally, but you're in that, that vicinity where you're learning through osmosis what they're teaching. And these are some of the best retail icons out there. I mean, Bernie Markets and Arthur Blank. I mean, they're, they're up.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: And so I feel that's my, my responsibility and I feel fortunate to be able to give back and pay it forward. So that's kind of my passion for retail and what I do to, to share that, that, that gratitude that I have.

Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, your, your LinkedIn is, is pretty incredible. I have to say. I thought I was doing a decent job until your feed started coming into mind.

Speaker B: It's like, I'll send you a check. Don't worry, I'll send you a check.

Speaker A: I'm just like, okay, I have no lack of reading material on a Sunday morning. You mentioned the Gap strategy and, uh, can you just kind of touch on what is the Gap strategy and in what part of new re retail ethos would somebody be able to find that? Is that in the book? Is that in your programming?

Speaker B: It's, it's kind of. No. I kind of created that. There's, there's some, there's some parts of it in the book, in the courses, but I created this strategy just for clients, uh, because, because it's, it's, it's specifically tailored. I cover, I, I share the, I'm going to show you the basic overview of it right now, but then we perform a deep dive with each client. So Gap stands for growth, Autonomy and Purpose. And I created it to provide a blueprint to my retail and business clients on how to ramp up their efforts to actively embrace employee engagement and intrapreneurship. So here are Some of the basic principles for executing my, my gap strategy. Under growth, you have succession planning. Again, this could take another 30 minutes to discuss this, but this is where it all starts. When employees are in your organization, you want to make sure that you're planning for their, for their succession and their growth. This is how you get someone to become an intrapreneur. You get, you get them to become a raving fan. And the question I always ask every retailer and every business leader is, are you strategically mapping out each employee or leader's future with the organization? And every, every business I work with or retailer I work with, there's, there's some, there's some work that needs to be done on this, on this exact strategy right here, just this piece. Because retail, uh, is changing so quickly that you have to be adapting your strategies. Like I went into one business and it was a 10 year old plant. And I'm thinking in 10 years a lot has changed in retail. A lot. And you have to make sure that you're strategically, again, that's the key word, mapping out each employee and leader's future with the organization. And uh, you don't do that just at their performance appraisal. You do that with the next piece, which is the daily check ins with employees and leaders. Are your leaders consistently performing this behavior which helps build and strengthen employee bonds? You know, daily checks and check ins. Check ins. Like when I was saying before, my, my greatest strength is my loyalty and then my second greatest strength is my leading by example and being hands on. So in a store like Home Depot, if somebody's making a bail, I'll jump in with them and it only takes about five minutes to make a bail, cardboard bail. And I'll say, hey, how's everything going? You know, how's everything happening? You know what, what's anything change with your, your goals? I saw you really get excited about doing some teaching and training in one of the uh, classes the other day with the customers. Is that something that maybe you want to add to your, to your, to your succession planning or it seems like you really, you were, you lit up when you started doing this. You're, you're a good orator. You really understand how to communicate concepts and information. So, and the person would be like, hey, yeah, you know what, I kind of would like to do that. So now in the back of my mind I think, okay, well let's update their succession planning. Get, pull out their file, update the plan. And now the next time there's an engagement of something that, that they have some experience on. Let's pop them in there and get them some more experience and kind of like be a minor, a minor mentor for them on that exact piece. Provide challenge and work. This is this one. People think that if they provide challenge and work that they're gonna run people out of the business. But people, most people like to be challenged. Now it's a double edged sword. If you challenge people but you don't provide them with the structure, the resources and the knowledge. Excuse me. And the time, then it's not going to work out because they're going to feel overwhelmed and they're going to be depressed and they're probably going to wind up leaving. So there's another. Again, there's more components to just this, but this is the overview. And most employees really want to engage in meaningful and fulfilling work. And then the last piece, now there's actually a few other pieces, but I just wanted to hit the top. 4 is competitive wages and benefits. Are you respecting and rewarding each employee's value and efforts to your company? Are you leading from the front or are you at the back of the bus? So that's the growth piece that we have. Excuse me. And that's the part that, that usually, that's the meat and potatoes with most, most clients. And then we get into the fun part, which I like, which is the a, which is the autonomy piece. And this is the one that I really, this is the one I enjoy the most because I have personal experience with this with throughout my retail career. The first piece is flexible scheduling options. Are you providing scheduling options that are flexible with your employees? Are you implementing a mild hybrid remote working option? People, when they heard me back in 2001, uh, I was implementing a hybrid remote working style with my employees at Home Depot. Now, uh, this was 22 years ago, I was doing this. Now when I say hybrid remote working, it's not three or four days a week at home. It's, it's, it's maybe one or two days here and there a week, if that, maybe a couple hours. And you can do that with. Think about leaders writing performance appraisals. You could, you could attest to this, Kasey, if you're working in retail and you're trying to write a appraisal for somebody and you get interrupted 10 times in an hour, your train of thought is, is, is lost and that employee is going to suffer. So, you know, it's hard to write appraisals inside of the store environment. In a busy, in a busy store environment like that because you're going to get interrupted with phone calls and customer issues, employee issues. So I would have my leader say, listen. I said, listen, take two hours, write the appraisal, bring it in, and I'll go ahead and compensate you for those two hours at home. Think about E learning modules nowadays with the technology. Have them tap into the intranet and do the E Learning modules while they're at home. Again, not interrupted. Because it's amazing how when you're in a training room and you're in a training class and it gets busy, there's some managers, hey, you know what? We got those 10 people back in the training class. Let's pull them out, we'll put them back in another time. There goes the training. The training is secondary. Think about preparing for an event or a presentation. You know, give them some time, again, quiet time, where they can focus. And then you have conference calls, you have Zoom meetings. So I didn't have the Zoom meetings back then, but I had conference calls and I did everything on what I just said. I did everything but the Zoom meetings. Because that wasn't available back then. I personally did it 22 years ago, so I know it can be done.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: Then you have empowerment. This is where you can build an army of entrepreneurs throughout your company. Again, we don't have time to go into all the different empowerment strategies, but the next part is trust and respect. Do you trust your employees to make the right decisions or do you punish them for their errors? We kind of talked about this a little bit before with the autonomy piece. And then you have inclusion and support. Are you including everybody? I, I always was at the top of all the HR metrics when it came to tenure, when it came to promotions, female managers. I always had more female managers than male managers, believe it or not. I just believed in including everybody. And in a home improvement environment back then, that was tough. That was tough because a lot of customers were very chauvinistic back then, which I couldn't stand. I never stood for that. Yeah, it was, it was really bad. So I included everybody. And there's some people that work aren't going to be cut out for each retailer or business. That's okay. But you include them and you support them and you find out by tapping into them. And you've heard me talk about this before, and I'll talk about this in the next section. Here is intrinsic motivation. So that leads me into the P, which is purpose. Are you fostering entrepreneurship? We've kind of covered this, uh, already. Are you tapping into employer and leader. Intrinsic motivation. Intrinsic motivation is, is quite simply something that somebody loves to do. Naturally they'll do it for free. They don't need to get paid for it. It's usually their hobbies, their passions and their interests. And how do you find that out? You talk to them and you get to know, uh, you know, my first goal when taking over any kind of store or district was remember the first and last name of every employee. Now it sounds easy, but it took me three months sometimes to get through to everybody because as part timers and we'll have some tough names, a lot of people that you don't want to mess up, Right?

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: And then real quick, the community involvement and volunteering all ties into the purpose. I found a lot of people that really wanted to be involved in the community. With Home Depot, there's Habitat for Humanity, the volunteering that they could go and volunteer with certain organizations. So that's kind of the overview of the, of the Gap strategy.

Speaker A: I mean ultimately we're talking about how to develop the best retailer retail leaders. Right? Leaders that carry the empathy for their employees in the organization and foster a, uh, growth environment. And I want to say kind of amplify this just one more time. You can know all of your employees and you can know what makes them tick and what they want to learn and know what, what their dreams are. Right. You know, I did it with 400 employees in one little store. You've been able to do it great. Managers know their people. Right? And they know and they learn how to manage their people and they grow. And I think that it's just very important because there's a lot of regionals, uh, and DMs that haven't taken that time to know the people in their division. So that's how we retain talent and build these retail careers, is creating that spark.

Speaker C: So I thinking about all these things, you've touched on a lot of different areas. Jeffrey, I. What would you say is the biggest opportunity for retailers today?

Speaker B: Ooh, m there. There's enormous opportunities right now that exist for retailers to thrive and succeed in the digital world. And that's kind of why I, I put the subtitle on my book Retailers Thrive, Thrive and Succeed in the Digital World. The biggest opportunity I see for retailers is to focus on improving employee engagement. I posted this week, I think it was on Tuesday on LinkedIn about a recent Gallup poll that showed him. And it was recent, it was this year that showed employee disengagement has reached a nine year high. And I'm like, wow, nine year high. That's, that's. And about 32. They said about 32% of the 67,000 full uh and part time employees surveyed were engaged in their work. A third were engaged. 18% were actively disengaged. And this is a staggering number of disengaged employees. So Gallup polls in my mind are usually a microcosm of the macrocosm. Now you're going to have some sectors and industries that are slightly immune to some of these, but generally it's a good gauge for the way they do their polls. So I'm noticing an alarming trend from some retailers to continue focusing on technology to improve their bottom line. And I, I fully support technology augmented and supplementing each retailer's brand. I really do. However, human engagement as shown by this poll is deteriorating at a precipitous rate. At new retail ethos, we spend around 70, I'd say about 75% of our time working with retailers and businesses on improving employee engagement. Because what happens is technology is bifurcation personified. On one hand, technology can drastically improve efficiency, scalability and seamless interactions across all touch points. However, technology is creating a buffered moat between customers and employees. I work with all the clients. I said, listen, we're not robots. We're human beings. And human beings innately crave human interaction. This social complex is built into our DNA and world class brands understand this dynamic intimately. So I created an axiom that I put on the back of my book and I share it quite frequently on LinkedIn and explains the situation. It's the future of retail. There's a healthy balance between technology, innovation and human engagement. So. And because this segment is so important, I've dedicated five sections in my top selling online course, the Ultimate Retail Course. And there's five chapters in my bestselling book, the Ultimate Retail Manual to Organizational Culture and the Power of Engagement. It's so important right now. It's, I go into retailers and businesses and they're, they're all about AI. And don't get me wrong, I'm, I'm all for technology. I really am an innovation. But I'm like, shouldn't you be talking about AI the same with the same excitement as you are about human engagement with your employees?

Speaker C: Right?

Speaker B: And you gotta remember employees right now, you know, are already intimidated and they have trepidation about automation coming. They already have that already. That's, that's already the undercurrent right now in retail. I mean, look at all the retailers that are Starting to go to automation.

Speaker C: Right.

Speaker B: And so they already have that going on. So it, now's the most critical time to maintain your core base of employees by making sure you're, you're ramping up your engagement. So that's again, three quarters of what I do is focused on that one specific topic. Now there's, there's many subsectors to that topic and we discussed a lot of them right here today. But the point is, is they're all focused on technology and that's great, but they're human beings and you got to really get back to that piece.

Speaker C: You have to wonder why is it that when you say three quarters of the time you're having these conversations, it makes you wonder why aren't there more retail leaders who are already factoring this in? Right. And thinking about this and considering exactly what you just described about that human factor, that we need to keep reminding everyone, Right. And having these conversations to keep that at the, at the top, top level of discussion.

Speaker B: Yeah, that's a great question. What I personally see from my experience, 30 years in the sector with the eight different retailers and now with the consulting now for going on eight years or five years now, intimately, is promoting, uh, the wrong leaders is the worst thing you can do. I, I, I, I share 10 questions that I had with every leader that wanted to be promoted. First reason I asked is why, why do you want to be promoted? Most important question of all, they don't know this, but that's the most important one. And not a lot of them would say, oh, I need to make more money and I want to have more, I want to have more authority. And, and those are all great answers, but they're not the right answers. I want to hear you say, you know what, I want to help people, I want to get out there, I want to lead by example. Now the higher you go, the less you can lead by example. You know, one of the things I didn't like about getting promoted was I had less hands on time, but it was more impactful when I was able to do it. But you know, you got to promote the right leaders. And one thing I saw, uh, progressively throughout my retail career was the person that got the most stuff done. That's a nice euphemism, is that the, the hardest worker got promoted. Well, generally the hardest worker is usually working on their own to promote their own brand and their own style to get promoted. And they're, they're sometimes not a good team player, they're not good with soft skills, they're not good with motivation and coaching. They're great at leading by example, but what are they leaving in their week? So promoting the wrong people. I, I walk into a lot of companies and retailers and you got people that are leading that, that shouldn't be leading. It's sometimes better to have nobody than the wrong person. Because when, when I saw Bernie Marcus leading, I saw the right way. But throughout my retail career, guys, I probably learned more what not to do from leaders than what to do. Because I just saw leaders that were, that were devaluing employees and ruining their confidence and insulting them. And the adage is praise in public, criticize in private.

Speaker A: Right?

Speaker B: And they'd be chewing somebody out on the floor. Customers are walking by employees, and I'm like, you know, and, and they're, and they're supposed to be my assistant or my store manager. And I'm like, so you gotta promote the right leaders. The second thing is you gotta make sure that the C Suite is passionate about people. And I know this is a cliche, but whenever I work with a retailer or a business, the first thing I want to do is walk the stores and I want to see it from a customer's perspective. Mhm. A lot of people, they go to work, meet with the C Suite first. I do that after because it's usually a stark contrast between what the employees and customers and leaders are seeing in the store versus what the C Suite. So Bernie Marcus, one time in 2000, he said, the store manager is the most important person in the company. And I thought, wow, I thought, I would think CEO, cfo, all the, all the titles coming down. And he, uh, thought, because each store manager is running a 60, $70 million business that they know intimately better than anybody else in the company. And he was right about that. But then Bob Nardelli took over and a lot of that culture went out the window when Bernie left. But yeah, you gotta, you gotta make sure that the leaders care about people. And it's really not that hard. It really isn't. All you gotta do is have some empathy, have some compassion. And I believe, I personally believe that every employee and leader can add value, but you gotta tap into that intrinsic motivation and obtain so powerful. When I, when I took over stores, I worked in five different states with Home, um, Depot. I worked in Florida, Michigan, Minnesota, Ohio, and finally here in Wisconsin. And every time I came to a store or a district, I would, I would. As I'm getting to know the people working with them side by side, you. You find out the lady in Paint, the department manager, she loves gardening. She used to own her own gardening business. And the, and the, the gentleman running garden, he loves woodworking. And you start moving all these people around and just putting them where they truly are. Now everybody in every department because hardware and lumber always want the best people. Right. You can't have 10 people over there. Right. Somebody's got to run the other department.

Speaker C: Somebody's got to be somewhere.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, you can, you can find out. Well, I can't put you in lumber right now because there's a brand new guy and he's still learning. But what else do you love to do? Well, you know, I love to teach and train. Great. Well, let's make you, let's make you one of our trainers. One of our part time trainers. You could always tap in. I've never found somebody that generally wanted to work, that cared that I couldn't tap into and find some.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: Some place I could put them for. They have a high chance of success. Never. I haven't found anybody yet. There's some people that just weren't meant for the company, that worked their way out of the business. But um, ultimately everybody wants to do a good job in the very beginning. And it all starts with the onboarding program which we can have another conversation about that down the road.

Speaker A: Well, I really like that. I'm going to kind of rephrase it. On promoting for the right reason.

Speaker C: Exactly.

Speaker A: Um, I think that that's really important because the best did I have. I have seen a lot of what you've seen as well. They got promoted for the wrong reasons. Right. Whether or not that was friends visibility or just doing outperforming in their own, but not really pulling the team. That's what managers do. Right. And you move up. This is just one of my. What has to be one of my favorite conversations. I mean I work all day with you. I really enjoy. I know, it's just, it's really just nice to have the amount of passion and energy that you share and kind of bring because it, and that's really why we really wanted to have you on this show is because I just hope some of our listeners like you just. It lights up fire in their belly again, you know, because I think coming out of the pandemic, a lot of managers, a lot of retailers have just kind of been beat up a little bit. And this is the kind of things that just really light that fire in the ballet that really get you motivated. So I hope everybody goes and gets a copy of your book. Grab A highlighter.

Speaker C: Exactly.

Speaker A: And start really looking at the business. I'm going to challenge every listener to know all of your employees and what they're passionate about by holiday season. And you'll have a killer holiday season. Very different. Knowing who your employees are.

Speaker C: Absolutely.

Speaker B: Absolutely. Um, the key with the book and the course is everybody always asks me this one question I know we got a few minutes left is, why did you start your first chapter with talent acquisition? That's my first pillar, talent acquisition. And then they said, why is second talent retention? They always ask me that and I'm like, I don't understand the question. I mean, I understand the question, but I don't understand why you're asking that.

Speaker C: Why are you asking?

Speaker B: Yeah, you have to. You have to hire top tier talent and then you have to retain that talent.

Speaker C: Right.

Speaker B: But most people think, oh, I want to get into sales and merchandising and coaching, and that's great. Don't give. That's coming. But I always coach everybody when they read the book and they take the course. That trust that each pillar is lined up perfectly for you to go through your ascension. It's a synergistic, Synergistic climb to absorb the information in the right time. And it provides the foundational pillars there in the beginning that you need with the onboarding. I, uh, I had eight different onboardings, and let's just say 50% were atrocious. Atrocious would be a kind word. It was bad. It was bad. So that, that's something that every employee or, uh, uh, every listener and student goes through the course of the book. Read each pillar. Okay. Go through each core and part of the course and digest it. Don't try to read it. I got some people that try to read the book in a week, and I'm like, no, don't. No, don't do that. Yeah, if you're going to do that, go back and read it again. Because I have people that read the book three, four, five times. And like Jeff, you know, I read it in the fourth time and I still, I just caught an epiphany from this one concept that you talked about. So it's a deluge of information. It's a manual. I mean, it's not super technical, don't get me wrong. But it's for a CEO and an employee, and it's kind of hard to write a book that compensates, kind of caters for both. So there's some big words in there that, that make the impact more powerful. But overall, it's it's, it's a manual. It walks you through the course. People ask for the course. When you get, when you purchase the course. Check this out. You now get. I've added a free copy of the book and I've also added two one hour coaching sessions with me personally, not my company, not my employees, with me personally. And people really enjoy that because, you know, to me, I want people to speak directly to me. Now there's some people that want to speak to a certain other employee that has a different niche specific, but generally they want to speak to me directly. They were asking me for that and I had that as an aside that you could purchase as an add on. So now in the course you get, you get the book, you get the uh, five week program and then you also get two personal one hour sessions with me. And what most people do is they usually do the first hour about halfway through the book or the course M. And then they do it at the end because they have so many questions

Speaker C: with all that makes sense, kind of

Speaker B: the process of how to go through the book and through the course.

Speaker C: Well, Jeff, thank you again for joining us today. You have so much, such a rich, uh, set of experiences and frameworks and knowledge to share and how you support growing retail leaders. Uh, I find it always fascinating to hear from you and to listen to you describe and explain all of these things. And as Kasey said, everybody go out and read the book if you haven't already because there's just so much to learn from that. And I think in the end everyone should realize, right, that the, there's only benefit right in your retail organization from um, understanding these concepts and applying them. Um, and I think it all comes back to what we started this conversation about. And it's that human factor. It comes back to, this is a business about people. And uh, you can't have great retail leaders without a good understanding of that human factor and building those relationships.

Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. One thing I wanted to add at the end real quick is that the book was written again from hands on experience. The course is from hands on. But here's a good example. I was speaking about feng shui concepts back in 2001, 22 years ago, Feng shui in retail, it's still, it's still not talked about.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker B: And it's a beginning when you create something. Don't get me wrong, part of me is like, yeah, I still got that, blah, blah, blah. But on the other hand it's like, you know, why isn't this being more talked about? It's about how energy moves through spaces and how you can create environments that are harmonious and positive versus chaotic and negative. You ever walk into a store and you're like, I can't wait to get out of here. You know, I just can't wait to get out of here. It's just crowded, it's. It's blocked, it's. It's, it's hot. And then you walk into another store and you're like, wow, I could, I could spend a couple hours here. And it's the curtly environment from Abercrombie and Fitch.

Speaker A: So.

Speaker B: Yes, I know.

Speaker A: You know, man. And it's just like encapsulated and a poof of perfume.

Speaker B: There you go. Tell us how you really feel, Casey. Tell us how you really feel.

Speaker A: I miss it. You know, it grew on you. Uh, I was just like. But, you know, these are, these are all really great things we could. I have no doubt we're going to have you on the show again. And again, I'm going to go get your buck. And I'm excited to read it because again, Ricardo, it's back to basics.

Speaker C: Yeah.

Speaker A: Even with all this automation, all of this talk of AI.

Speaker C: That's right.

Speaker A: If we can't grasp and refamiliarize ourselves with the basics.

Speaker C: Right.

Speaker A: What are we teaching these machines?

Speaker C: Exactly. Exactly.

Speaker A: Because we have to go back to the basics and make sure that we're amplifying what we're supposed to be amplifying.

Speaker C: Exactly. Automating that foundation.

Speaker A: Supposed to be automating, you know, so I think it's. This is very important for every, every brand, every retailer, anybody who's in the business to just really understand I need to just kind of take a step, absorb, and start implementing more structure. When they're looking at these things and it's about the people, that's why we're all here.

Speaker B: Perfect.

Speaker A: We love our customers.

Speaker B: Uh, and they love you back.

Speaker C: That's right.

Speaker A: They take care of them. They will take care of you.

Speaker C: Exactly.

Speaker A: Well, Ricardo, on that note, I'd say this is a wrap.

Speaker C: I think. So.

Speaker A: If you enjoyed our show, please consider giving us a five star rating and review on Apple Podcasts. Remember to smash that subscribe button in your favorite podcast player and catch us on YouTube so you don't miss a minute. If you want to know more about what we talked about today, take a look at the show notes and handy links for more details. And be sure to sign up for our new substack newsletter or the full transcript of this show. I'm your co host, Casey Golden.

Speaker C: And if you'd like to connect with us and share your feedback, follow us and the show on Twitter @KCC Golden, Ricardo Belmar, and at Retail Razor. Or find us on LinkedIn. And if you need even more from us, be sure and check out and subscribe to our Substack newsletter. I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar.

Speaker A: Thanks for joining us.

Speaker C: And remember, there's never been a better time to be in retail if you cut through the clutter. Until next time, this is the Retail Razor Show.