The CX Iconoclast · 2025-10-20 · 29 min
In this episode of The CX Iconoclast, Richard Owen sits down with Joe MacLeod - author, speaker, and self-proclaimed “Head of Endineering” - to explore one of the most overlooked parts of customer experience: the ending. Drawing on insights from his books and decades of experience, Joe explains why most companies obsess over creating desire and delivering products, yet neglect the final stage of the customer journey. From cable companies using aggressive tactics to retain customers to gyms making it difficult to cancel, he reveals how poorly designed endings damage brands, waste resources, and miss opportunities to strengthen relationships. Joe argues that by designing graceful, dignified exits, companies can encourage customers to return, generate positive word of mouth, and even unlock new business. Joe makes a great business case for good endings, across industries, from B2C subscriptions to B2B relationships. Perhaps surprisingly, he also suggests how an easy, transparent exit process can actually increase customer acquisition, citing examples from streaming services, retail returns, and corporate off-boarding.
Rewiring CX: Bill Staikos on Human-Centered AI and the Future of Experience Leadership58 / 100From Cost-Cutting to Customer Growth: A Smarter AI Strategy - with McKinsey partner Tey BannermanThe KPI Revolution: Turning Data into Decisions Using AI - With Michael Schrage of MITWhat 25 Years of Tech Research Tells Us About the Future of AI - With Cornell's Chris FormanAI, Culture, and the Future of Customer Experience: A Conversation with Murli Buluswar of Citi