Her Grandfather Helped Build Chrysler, Now She's Leading the Industry | Katie Naughton

Speaker A: I think I just want to be known for that. I was a trailblazer, that I did make a difference and that I made an impact on people's lives in a positive way is really what I want to be known for. Welcome to the Sensei Playbook, the ultimate podcast for the automotive industry. Each week we dive into the success stories and best practices from industry leaders who put customer experience first. From driving repeat business to earning coveted referrals. Discover the tools and tactics that set the best apart. Get ready to hit the road to success. This is the Sensei Playbook.

Speaker B: Welcome back to the Sensei Playbook, where we dig into the habits, culture and leadership DNA, uh, of people moving the needle in automotive. Today's guest grew up in the car business in her bloodline. Her grandfather was an executive in Detroit working alongside the legendary Lady Lee Iacocca. And her father ran Mike Naughton Ford in Denver for nearly five decades. But Katie Nalton didn't inherit her success. She packed Everything up at 32 years of age and moved to Toronto and bought her own dealership, placing her in the exclusive club in the automotive industry where less than 1% of members are women. After nine years of building a culture driven operation and strategic exit at the top of the market, she's now a partner at dsma, guiding dealers through major M and A decisions, and the founder of Drive Her Forward, a platform for ambitious women seeking leadership development. Katie, welcome to the Sensei Playbook. First of all, I want to say it was a pleasure meeting you recently naba, and I'm so grateful for the conversation. Today. I want to dive into your mission at, uh, Drive for Forward and learn more about what you're doing at bsma. But first, can we go back in time for a moment? Your grandfather was an executive at Ford Motor Company and Chrysler, working alongside Lee Iacocca. And your father ran Mike NAUGHTON Ford for 47 years. And your uncles also owned stores across the country. What was it like being a kid growing up in the car business at this level?

Speaker A: I was just a kid, to be quite honest with you. Uh, funny story. I mean, I grew up in the dealership, in the shops. I remember walking around back in the day with my dad being, you know, probably still in diapers, running around and, you know, that's just all I knew was car dealerships. But, you know, you mentioned my, my grandfather and I always knew he worked at Ford. I always knew he was, you know, a corporate guy. It wasn't until high school that I even realized who he was or what kind of impact he made on this business. And in fact, it was. My dad had a framed article that he. They did. Did some kind of piece on him in the. I think it was Denver Post or Rocky Mountain News. But anyway, he had it framed in his office and I was reading it. I was at that point where you start to look at that stuff at that age and turn around and went, I didn't know Grandpa was vice president of Ford. And just started laughing. He goes, well, yeah, and Chrysler too. And so it was just one of those like, aha. Moments of, you know, we just, we grew up. My dad owned a dealership. We loved to go see him because he always worked. And we grew up, we did our sports, we went to school. It was, I don't know, it was just a normal thing for us. It wasn't a big deal. Right.

Speaker B: He was grandfather to you, right?

Speaker A: Yeah, he was. Grandpa. We love to go see him, you know, in the summers. He had a. They had an amazing house. They, you know, they had a place up in Michigan, which, you know, is fitting because that's where they all lived and grew up. And then they had a place in Florida and we love to go there in the summertime because what kid doesn't want to go hang out on the beach in Florida? Part of Florida, uh, down on Sanibel island, actually.

Speaker B: Nice. Nice. Very nice. And so was your grandfather one of the ones that, um, Iacocca took with him from Ford to Chrysler?

Speaker A: Correct. So they grew up in the ranks together. They, they started out as, from what I understand, working in the cubicle. They had the cubicle across from each other doing whatever they were doing and just grew up through the system together. And, uh, my grandfather actually had retired at that point from Ford Motor Co. And when Lee Iacopa went over to Chrysler, he had pulled my grandfather out of retirement to come in. And when was that? Uh, the 80s. And got back involved and. Yeah. Helped turn Chrysler around with.

Speaker B: Reinvented it. Really?

Speaker A: Yep. A hundred percent.

Speaker B: Wow, that's so cool. So what were some of the principles and values your father instilled in you and your grandfather at an early age that show up in your work today?

Speaker A: Uh, I think just, just, just hard work just show up. You know, that is one thing. Particularly my father. My grandfather passed away when I was, was 14, so I. Still younger and, and, um, but I think just hard work. To my father's almost last dying day, he was at that dealership. Um, he, you know, he loved it. He loved being there. He loved being in the middle of the mix, loved his employees. And I think that's one thing that, that I learned is just if things are going to happen, you have to make it happen. It's not going to happen for you and nobody else is going to get it done for you. And yeah, that was always, I think, the biggest thing. Like I said, he was there every day. I don't know that there was a day that he wasn't there. And in fact, after we sold the dealership and he didn't have a place to go, it's kind of sad. But he declined really quickly, his health, because that's what he lived for. And I know there's a lot of dealers out there that are that way. We would have loved for him to go retire and go live his life and travel the world and he had zero interest in it. He just wanted to be there and sell cars.

Speaker B: That is very common in the automotive industry.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.

Speaker B: I'm, um, curious to what your father taught you about the customer experience.

Speaker A: Customer experience. So he, he might, he was a piece of work. And I don't know how much you, you know, you've seen of him or what, you know, what he's done, but, you know, he was uh, a character in Colorado. So he was very heavily, like did the commercials, the radio advertising. Um, in fact, I went to school, uh, out of state because I got tired of being known as Big Mike's daughter. You know, I had a name and I wanted to build my, you know, a name and a career for myself. I just was tired of that. But anyway, I guess what I'm trying to get to there is he was just the face in the name of the dealership. And he would sit in the showroom. We had a big round showroom and a big like octagon style tower right in the middle of it. And he would stand up there and greet every customer that walked in, would talk to them. We laugh because he actually had hero cards made up and would like sign them and send out autographs with his picture and his cowboy hat. And um, you know, I still have one framed and you know, it's just like, who does that? But he did and it worked and people loved it. And. And uh, he was a storyteller too. Ah, he, I mean, he would just talk your ear off and tell you stories about everything from, you know, his early days at Ford and living up in Canada at the Oakville plants and all that stuff. And customers loved it. Like there just would be. When I took over, I mean, I Worked there my whole life, really. But when I really took over leadership in the dealership and owning it in 2019, there were so many customers that would just come in my office and say, you know, your dad is a legend. He's been such a staple of this community. He helped us through, you know, this organization or, uh, he provided money here and he's done so much for us. And we just were loyal to the end with, with this guy. So, yeah, I mean, customers always came first. He, he loved them. That's what again, he strived for, was to, was to please them.

Speaker B: Relationship selling at its best, right?

Speaker A: For sure.

Speaker B: He was a, uh, master at self promotion, it sounds like.

Speaker A: Oh, yeah.

Speaker B: I mean, that, that is so cool.

Speaker A: Uh, I think it depends on who you asked. I mean, it's just, it's who he was and what he did. And that was a different, certainly a different time back then as well.

Speaker B: A lot of dealer kids either get handed the keys to the kingdom or walk away entirely. And you did something different. You went and built your own. Where did that drive to own your own thing come from instead of just inheriting what was already there?

Speaker A: So I think I just always inherently had that. You know, I grew up, I was, I, uh, was an elite athlete, I was an elite gymnast, you know, so that was very, it was very focused on that. Uh, like I said, I, I, you know, when I went to university, I wanted to get out of Dodge. I was just tired of being associated with Big Mike. You know, I wanted to pave my own path and start my own way. So I did that. I initially wanted to be a sports broadcaster. I wanted to be one of the girls on the sidelines, Erin Andrews, and report on the NFL games kind of thing. And so I went to school for broadcasting and I learned real quick that it was. Wasn't for me. Uh, I continued on with it, but I, I just, uh, it didn't come naturally to me. It was, you know, if you have to think so hard to talk, then, you know, I don't know, it just didn't seem like the right career path. So anyway, I continued on in the media field and went and sold radio advertising and, and thought that was the path that I wanted to go into. And I did that for a couple years. Um, and it wasn't until then that, you know, like, I, again, the dealership was just. That was my dad's thing. That was never what I aspired to be. And it wasn't until I was selling radio advertising and I had all them pointing out What I had, you know, the opportunity that I had sitting in front of me is when I started to realize what was really going on. And so I said, you know what? You're right. Maybe I should go and give this a shot and see if this is anything that, you know, is worth doing. And, you know, I had worked there before in high school, but, you know, I was like, pulling weeds and painting a fence and, you know, just doing all the stupid jobs that, you know, my dad just needed dust. So I didn't really know the car business. And, um, yeah, so it was about my early 20s that I went to go work for him. And that's when I started. You know, he put me into the accounting office for a while and I broke down deals and bored me to tears. I, you know, I hated being up there, but, you know, I learned a lot. And then he put me down on the sales floor and that's when I started to, uh, you know, start selling cars. And my uncle was the used car manager at the time, and, you know, I spent a lot of time with him down at the used car lot and learning all things used cars. And, you know, you just. I slowly progressed through it. Um, I did get back into radio for a short stint thinking, you know, maybe I don't love cars. Maybe I want to go to radio. And that didn't last very long. And finally I came back and I said, dad, I'm going to do this. I'm going to. Let's go all in. Let's. If we're going to do it, let's do it. He said, okay, great. And he has mine. He wanted to, you know, coach and train me and everything. But he had a general manager at the time that said, no, you need to go to the NADA Dealer Academy in D.C. and so I enrolled. My dad actually didn't want me to go. Thought it was the dumbest idea ever. Um, he had the mentality of like, I can teach you more than anybody, you know, classroom or anybody there. But the GM pushed it and it was something I wanted to do and I believed in. And, uh, yeah, so in 2008, I went to the, uh, to the academy. I was in the general managers course, so I didn't sign up for the Dealer Kids one. And quite honestly, I didn't really even know the difference at the time. Uh, it just so happened to work out for scheduling. And I'm glad that it did because I met some amazing people and it was very. It's very much a different dynamic when you have people in there that are trying to make their own path or working for dealer principals versus just working for mom and dad.

Speaker B: And what role were you at the dealership when you went to the academy? Were you in sales management?

Speaker A: Yeah, I would say sales manager. Like a GM protege. It wasn't really a gm, but I was working very closely with my dad and the gm. So it was just one of those, I would say like hybrid spots. Yeah, uh, I was at the tower at the desk working deals like constantly getting called into all whatever meetings were going on and very trying to learn all things across the dealership in all departments.

Speaker B: Gotcha. Interesting. And so now you're roughly 1% of female dealership owners in North America. And you didn't inherit your store, you bought it in a foreign country at what, 32 years of age?

Speaker A: 32, yep.

Speaker B: Wow. And so when you walked into a room as a female dealer principal, what was the unspoken dynamic you had to navigate and how did you handle that?

Speaker A: Yeah, so it was intimidating. And it was intimidating for many, many years. I mean, I think just even getting into, you know, buying the dealership yourself, like to, to, to even come up to the conclusion that you're actually going to go out and, and do that for one, um, I think was a big step in my life. And I remember being terrified and scared and how are we going to afford it? What are we going to do? And I was worried, forget about the business side of it. I was worried about like, what if we get sued for somebody slipping on the ice and what do we do? And you know, that's where somebody just said there's people that help and handle that. You don't have to worry about every little detail today. You know, just get the score. So yeah, we enlisted the help of a broker that helped us uh, buy the actually dsma. When they first started, I think we were deal number three for them because they were just launching. Interesting. And yeah, and so we ended up getting the Kia store. And I think this is kind of important because we went into this thinking, my husband and I went and bought it together and we co owned it together. And when we first were on this path, we thought, well we're gonna, he came from Porsche. So we thought we'll get something high end. We'll go to Mercedes or BMW or Lexus or whatever. And we learned real quickly that that's not how that works. You know, you don't just walk in and say this is what I want and like pick it off a shelf.

Speaker B: Um, right.

Speaker A: One, they are not available Very often. And two, if they are, you're up against the big boys. And so even down to we were looking at a Ford store and thought we were going to put an offer in or actually did put an offer in and one of the big groups came out down and just plumped an extra million dollars on their offer and won it. I mean it's, we couldn't compete at that, at that deal. So you know, we ended up getting the Kia dealership. And yeah, it was intimidating at the time. Um, you had Maria Soplas who was the, was the vice president and she was running the country, she was running Canada. And so one, I think it was great and fantastic for me to walk into, you know, headquarters and have that initial meeting with her with another female. But let me tell you, that was probably more intimidating than walking into the boardroom with all of them men, right? So, you know, she, she was tough and, and you know, but we built a great relationship throughout the years and everything else and something that I truly value. But you know, then you walk in with all the dealers across, uh, across Canada, which are product, which are all male for the most part. You may have had the daughters, a few of the daughters or everything, but I, you know, to this day I still don't know very many women that have gone out and bought their own dealerships. And so it was something that, it just took a while. But you learn the room, you read the room, you find the people that are on board with you and want to work with you and actually respect what you're doing and you latch on to them. And then there's others that just, they're going to, they forgot more than I'm ever going to learn kind of thing. And that's their mentality and they will teach me the car business. And you just, I don't know, they are who they are and I think they have a lot of good things that you can learn from when they do voice their opinions and meetings. But you don't necessarily need to feed into their egos or what they're doing.

Speaker B: Right. What was the big difference in operating a store in the States versus Canada?

Speaker A: I think down to the day to day business, for the most part, it's all pretty the same. We didn't have spot deliveries or anything like that in Canada. So you, you know, people come in, you buy the car, you license it, you come pick it up a couple of days later. What I would say the biggest difference is, it's just, it's the, the wild, wild west in the Us, it's just, you're shooting from the hip, you're going, you're, you know, everything is just kind of, you fly by the seat of your pants. Canada. I just felt like it was a little bit more regulated, a little bit more structured. Uh, you knew what you were getting into for the most part on a day to day basis. Where some days when I was down at the Ford dealership in Denver, I, I don't know. Yeah, like you go in with a plan and you walk out with a completely different day that happened.

Speaker B: And going back to it being a male dominated industry, did you feel pressure to lead like a man or did you find early on that leading as a female was actually a competitive advantage?

Speaker A: That's a great question. So I started out, my dad was tough. He was a tough guy and, and very much the. Grew up with the mentality of it's kind of my, uh, my way or the highway or you don't like it, there's the door. You know, that kind of approach to management. And that's all I knew, that's all I saw. I thought that's the way it happened, you know, and it, if it wasn't from him, it was from his sales managers or the general managers or whatever the case may be. And so I just assume that that's how you managed and operated a business. So. Yes. So when I first got into it, that's the approach that I took because that's all I knew. It really started, started to shift my approach when I got up to Kia and realized that people are not gonna work for you or do strive to be better or do more, go above and beyond for somebody that's not gonna do the same for them in return. And it's almost that you need to do more for them to meet you at that level. And so that was a shift that I learned very quickly up in Kia. And maybe I don't think it's a Canadian thing, I think it's a leadership thing, but I really learned it up there. And that's when I shifted my tune, uh, of okay, I am here for the, here for my employees. And the more that I do for them, the more that they will do for me. And it just, it was amazing how quickly it shifted. And you know, I had some fantastic employees. And by the time we ended up selling, I would consider a lot of them just my friends. And I was in tears, just cry. I was so upset because I was sad to leave them, but they were just as sad and brought me flowers and special Mementos and gifts and all of that. And it really meant a lot to me. And I think when you approach business like that, it just drives forward and it's so much more fun, uh, that way. It's pleasant walking in work and working together as a team.

Speaker B: Right. And I love that because when we train dealerships, we talk about exceptional customer experience. Only comes from exceptional employee experience. Richard Branson says it best. Customers don't come first. Employees come first. Take care of the employees and they'll take care of your customers.

Speaker A: Absolutely.

Speaker B: So often in the automotive industry, we just don't see that. We see that the, the people are not treated well and then the dealer expects the teams to take care of the customer. And it doesn't happen.

Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. I just, I think, uh, for me personally, just the egos needed to be set aside. And I can't tell you how quickly it happened and it turned around. It was, it was amazing and something that I, I do value because it was, uh, it was really fun to watch and just numbers and everything skyrocketed. And we had, we always had a saying, well, a couple of things y', all, we were very much on. Everybody had to offer somebody a coffee and we, we almost challenged the employees or we want customers to almost complain that they were offered a coffee too many times, which, you know, happened every now and then. But it was like, you know, that's the argument, like, okay, our team was looking after you. If that's the worst thing that we did, then we're okay with it. The other big saying that we had, and we learned this at Disney University was Cinderella doesn't have a bad day. And that was a big mentality through our organization of, you know, we always need to be on for our customers. We can't, you know, let all of the negative things that are going on in our, in our lives or behind the scenes of the dealership or whatever the case may be come to the forefront and be, you know, witnessed or experienced by the elsewheres.

Speaker B: That's awesome. I think culture often breaks down in the gap between what leaders say and what they actually do. And you were just speaking about this earlier, what were some of the non negotiable behaviors that you modeled every day that your team watched closely?

Speaker A: Uh, I just, I think just treat people the way that you want to be treated. Was, was first and foremost. Um, I'm a big believer in that. Uh, I was very active. In fact, my husband and I both were very active and on the floor. We, when we first had, we had an initial dealership, and then we did a remodel and moved. And when we had the first one, my husband's office was literally on, uh, the showroom floor in a cubicle. I mean, that was his. He didn't have, you know, the office upstairs with accounting and all of that. I did, but I was never in it. We were always just down on the floor again. I learned that from my dad, being down with the customers, down with the staff, in the trenches. Uh, you know, my. My team would joke because my husband was very good on the sales side of things. I was very good in big sops. So I spent a lot of time back in the shop and in the parts department. And they would always joke. They always knew when I was coming around because they could hear my heels. I was always in heels. And, you know, like, they knew you were coming. They knew I was coming. In an odd day, I had flats on. They. They would be surprised because they didn't know I'd sneak up on them. But, yeah, I spent a lot of time. I'd be on the drive, service drive, writing up work orders and moving cars and driving cars. And if the snowstorm, like my husband always says, he goes, I was the first one out there in a snowstorm, shoveling the drive in my heels. So.

Speaker B: Wow. Wow. What would you say the toughest culture challenge you ever had to solve at the dealership? Maybe a moment where the team or the values were genuinely at risk.

Speaker A: I think I wrote a blog on this recently. I, uh, think the first one that comes to m mind anyway is just dealing with toxic employees. I think there's a fine line of, you know, you want to perform. You're a business owner, obviously, you have to report everything to, you know, manufacturers and banks on a monthly basis. And the numbers do matter. And so, you know, you're always striving to have a successful business. And when you have performers that are helping drive those numbers, it's tough sometimes to, I don't want to say recognize, maybe just admit to yourself that this person maybe not be a good fit it for the rest of the team and is causing some disruption or, you know, chaos within the organization. And so I think that's kind of a big one that we had to go through a few times, you know, where you. You try to work with it and you try to navigate it, but at the end of the day, it's just better. You may take a hit for a month or two or three or whatever, but cutting that cancer out is ultimately going to drive Business and revenue further ahead than if you didn't.

Speaker B: I can relate completely. My number one car salesman, or excuse me, my number one salesman that I had Car Smarts magazine was phenomenal. I mean, he was like really good at getting a lot of revenue because we used to sell those magazine ads, remember the free magazines at the front of stores. So we did that for many, many years. And this kid was 25, 26, making 135 grand a year selling magazine ads. And this is in 2006. But he would stay up all night playing video games and then he would come into my, uh, sales meetings and he was just negative and didn't want to role play, didn't want to participate. And even though he was the number one guy, I kept telling him, you've got to be a team player. And just like you, it was a hard decision. But I had to cut him out because he was just toxic. He wasn't good for the team and that's always tough. So employee is so very important. So in your mind, what's the difference between a dealership that delivers good customer service and one that delivers a genuinely memorable customer experience?

Speaker A: That's a great question. I would say, you know, I'm going to go back to, um, it just comes down to the leadership and the principles that are driving the dealership. You know, it comes from the top. And if the top genuinely cares and wants it to be a memorable experience, than it will be, um, because they will be hands on and involved in the day to day to ensure that it's happening. You can sit and we had it all, map out every playbook and plan and employee handbook and whatever, like what you should do and what you shouldn't do and everything else. But until it's practiced and preached repeatedly and really shown, you have to show and practice what you preach to your, your staff and they're in turn going to do it. And it really, I saw it happen. And the minute that we backed off for whatever reason, if we got sidetracked because we were very involved in, especially when we were traveling back and forth between Toronto and Denver and you're not there all the time, things start to slip. And if you're not doing it every day, then you know they're going to sometimes revert to bad habits.

Speaker B: That's right. That's right. Was there a moment, a specific customer interaction that crystallized for you what you and your husband were actually building, A story that still sticks with you?

Speaker A: I think the first one that just pops in my head is we had A lady who, her name was Kat. She was a customer in ikea. She drove this green soul, like an alien green soul. And she loved that thing and she came in and she serviced it like crazy. But she brought me flowers. Flowers and a, ah, birthday card one year, which just blew me away. One, I didn't even know how she knew my birthday had broadcast, but she did. And oh yeah, that's special.

Speaker B: That's really cool.

Speaker A: It was. And of course her, her card was green and the flowers were green. That was just her thing. But you know, it was just one of those. It blew me away and it touched my heart that, you know, it's, we have done something right and it mattered and she wanted to just thank me for it through a thank you card and a small bouquet of flowers.

Speaker B: Right. And your work was touching people. That's incredible. So the automotive industry often struggles with delivering a consistent customer experience. Where do you think that comes from at its root? Is it a people problem, process problem or a leadership problem?

Speaker A: I think it's all three. We always say it's people, process culture. Um, you know, it's, you have to have good people to have, you know, that are going to follow a good process and create a good culture. I think within the automotive, uh, industry, unfortunately there's, there's a lot of turnover, which you're starting from scratch a lot of times trying to bring people in and not to say that they can't adopt your culture very quickly, but I think that's sometimes what happens, or you get the toxic employee in the mix and you just gotta. That, that sometimes takes time to cycle through. So yes, I do. I think it 100% starts at the top and you have to create the, uh, the process that you want and the people are going to be the ones that implement it. So it's. Again, I'm going to go back to you. You can write it all down, you can put it all on paper, but if you don't practice what you preach, then it's just never going to happen.

Speaker B: That's right. So Y' all spent nine years building 401 Dixie Kia into something you are clearly proud of selling. It had to be emotionally a real emotional decision. Just beyond, really beyond the marketing timing. What was the internal conversations that ultimately led you to that decision?

Speaker A: Yeah, um, so that was a tough time. So when I'll back up a little bit. In 2000, I think it was 19, 18, 19. Anyway, whenever we had just flown from Toronto to San Francisco for the nada, I think it was the Last time nad was in San Francisco and literally just got to the hotel, and I got a call from my dad, who, who was sick, and he just said, listen, I'm struggling. I'm having a hard time running the Ford dealership, and I need you to get involved today. You know, next flight was off to Denver to go figure out what was going on there and get involved. And so I did. And long story short, there, I ended up taking over that dealership. I became a, uh, dealer principal and F1 status and had to fill out all the dealer application. And life was great. You know, in my mind, I'm like, okay, I finally got to the family dealership. I'm going to run that. I've got my Kia dealership up here. And this is, I think, every dealer's most dealer's dream at some point is to expand and have more and grow your platform there. And so I was super excited about that. And everything was fine until Covid hit. And that's when things derailed because we were not able to cross the border anymore or as easily as we could before where we were traveling back and forth. And as you know, Covid in one country was difficult enough. To navigate it in two countries was super challenging because regulations change by the minute, and Canada was certainly way more strict in what they were doing. I think we were shut down for a year and a half up there. We were down to five employees that we were dealing with. Um, you know, and we had a Ford store that shut down for maybe, I don't even think it was three months, month and a half or something. And then they were back up and running. So it was a little bit of a different dynamic in that time. We decided it was easier to divide and conquer. So my husband went down and ran the Ford store. I stayed up in Canada and ran Kia. But again, we couldn't travel. So I didn't see him really for almost, uh, a year and a half. And if I did, he had to come up and quarantine for two weeks at a time. And Canada was strict. They actually came and would knock on your door to ensure that you were there, and sometimes do it on the 14th day in the final hour to ensure that you were sitting at home quarantining. So that's what we were dealing with. I would never wish that anybody. It's not fun.

Speaker B: Wow.

Speaker A: So it was, uh, it was brutal. So at the time, we were approached by somebody who wanted to buy the Ford store. My dad was sick, um, my brother was sick. He was involved in the business. And it just got to the point where, you know, I didn't really want to sell. But, you know, after beating your head so many times against a brick wall, sometimes you're like, okay, well, maybe I'll entertain the idea. And it actually just kind of so worked out that the Shop Automotive Group bought the dealership in 2021, I believe it was. So that one sold that was done. We moved on, went up, back to Toronto and we're running Kia and we just kind of sit and we're looking at each other going, we're burnt out, just we're tired. It's between dealing with COVID and then just the Buy sell and not seeing each other and traveling back and forth since 2019 between Denver and Toronto every week. It just, we were just done. And then we saw a webinar from, I don't know, Cada or something. And everything was very gloom and doom about the future of the business. It was so negative. And I remember just going into Eric's office and saying, maybe it's time. And he didn't disagree. I just felt like my whole life at that time, I was walking through with boxing gloves and I didn't know who I was going to be fighting that day, whether it was going to be the oem, the government customer, an employee. Uh, you know, it's just, it was. I just felt like so much was thrown at me so quickly that I just, I was, I was tired. And so we went back to our, uh, friend Freed who owns dsma, and we thought, well, let's just find out what's going on. We know what the market is in the US and what multiples are and everything else, but we really didn't know in Canada. So he invited us over for dinner one night just to have a fact finding conversation, which quickly turned into, we're going to get a valuation on our store, we're going to list it for sale. He wanted us to come work for him at dsma. He wanted us to move to the US over, open a western office and, you know, take over. So my head was spinning after that.

Speaker B: Wow, what a transition. Because my next question was geared toward after you, you know, had certainly been running the store, what, nine years now. How do you fill that, that space? And you clearly had something lined up with the sma, Right?

Speaker A: We did what we didn't. I mean, that wasn't really the intention, but it just kind of fell in our lap, so to speak.

Speaker B: Right, nice. Uh, so you went from the being on the seller side of the Transaction to now advising dealers through some of the biggest financial decisions of their lives. Going to work for dsma. How did going through the sell of your own store change the way you show up for your clients?

Speaker A: Yeah, so that's a big one because I think I. Not only could I relate to just the transaction side of everything and what you have to do to buy and sell a store there, like you said, or uh, your last question, there's a lot of emotions involved and that's something where I think until you do it, you don't understand what kind of emotions are involved. There's so many different reasons. I mean, mine, I was just burnt out and I was tired. But that was for Kia. For Ford, it was a family legacy. I fought tooth and nail for months to. I didn't even want to talk to him or entertain it because in my mind it was, I'm, um, giving up, I'm um, feeling my grandfather, my father, what they've built. And here we are, we're just gonna, we're gonna sell it. Like that didn't make sense. I grew up in the place. I drew pictures and stuck em on the wall for my dad and he still has those like little sticky note things that I drew for him. So that was challenging. And I think that's one area that I was able to empathize with the dealers who were selling and you know, there's various different reasons. Some are going through divorces, um, some, their kids don't want it and they're disappointed by that. Others are sick when others just don't want to do it anymore. They're tired.

Speaker B: What do dealers fundamentally misunderstand about the value of their business when they first come to the table?

Speaker A: I think there's a lot of stuff that, you know, there's numbers thrown around and multiples thrown around and, and one thing, I think the biggest thing is that, you know, they just take their bottom line, their net and take it by the multiple that's published out there. And you know, if Kia is currently at, I don't know, six times earnings, they just assume because, you know, they're making a million dollars a year, it's worth $6 million and you know it. Okay, that may give you a general idea, but it's so much more complex than that. There's a lot of add backs, there's a lot of things that come into evaluation and a proper number. People don't realize that if they have family members on their payroll that you can add that income back. Assuming that's not something that the new owners would take on or husband, wife. If the wife is just on the salary, it doesn't show up for ever. The boats, the planes of this, like there's a lot of add backs that come in and a lot of times these numbers are quite a bit higher than what they actually are initially thought that they would be. And other times they're lower because they got so much stuff going on that it works negatively and they're in their financials. But I would say all in all, I think 90% of the time it's actually going to be better. And if you do a proper valuation and put the uh, take the time and the investment into it, it's going to pay off at the end.

Speaker B: And it's so important to have the right team during that process, uh, during the M and A process. My second wife used to work for uh, private equity, so they were in the business buying and selling. So the current buy sell market has been volatile, hot cycles, rising rates, oem pressure. What are the patterns you're seeing right now among dealers who are thinking about timing an exit?

Speaker A: To be honest, Chris, I've kind of been out of it for the last year, so I don't know that I really have a full proper pulse on um, what the market is today. Uh, my husband Eric is still very involved and he's running the Western U.S. there is a lot of activity. I will say that, um, there is. They've had record years for dsma just, you know, they've been in the US for I don't know, maybe six, seven years now. And every year is getting more and more and obviously it's, they're just growing and, and you know, more awareness for them. But the dealer body, the average dealer age, uh, you know, a couple years ago was like, I don't know, 7, 78, 80 years old, something like that. So you know, the, all these old car buys like my dad are starting to phase out and they're seeing that a lot of the kids are not really interested at all. They have no desire to get into this business. So you are seeing a lot of the bigger groups that are coming in and buying up stuff. You know, the, the big groups, the, the Lithias and the Sonics and the Asbury's and all that. They went through a phase where they were buying a lot and then they really scaled back for a minute. And I think you're starting to see them, you know, re engage into the marketplace. The guys that, you know, maybe have three, four, five stores or uh, want to grow. There are good opportunities for them. The mom and pops that just have the one are looking to kind of get out. And um, even the two, three dealerships, um, you're starting to see those kind of fizzle out a little bit as well. So.

Speaker B: Right, well, let's transition to your latest project, Driver Forward. Tell me about your mission there.

Speaker A: Yeah, so Driver Forward is uh, my, my new venture that I created. It's, I launched it in October. And this is a, a female empowerment platform for leadership. And really what drove this is uh, I can't tell you how many times I sat in my, you know, my office up at Ikea and felt very alone. Um, leadership is, is lonely or being at, you know, ownership is lonely and being at the top. But being a female, I'm going to say any business, but in this business I just didn't feel I had anybody to turn to or talk to or helped me validate if any my feelings or what was going on in my head was normal or if I was crazy. I was very heavily involved in a lot of the women in automotive stuff, primarily up in Canada. And you know, I think the intention was good and the efforts were there, but I also felt that they was very um, shallow. And when I say shallow, like you just never got past the surface. Uh, we wanted just to uh, talk about how hard done by we were by being females in a male dominated business. And after hearing that narrative for so long, it just got old. It was, it was tiring, it was there, there's gotta be something else that we can talk about. And I wanted something deeper, um, and more valuable. Um, so that's kind of, you know, my, my mentality was then, and not that I really thought I was ever going to build this platform, but then, you know, going through my experiences with DSMA and everything else, it just kind of seemed like it was time to do that. I felt like there was a place in the market where, you know, you still look at the women in automotive stuff and there's, there's so many platforms and great things, but it, it still didn't dive down into what I wanted and what I felt I needed to see. And people are striving for community. I think people, people are striving for that connection. We have all the social media in the world right now, yet we still feel alone. And again, even that it's really just AI generated and inauthentic. There's nothing there. So, um, that's where I think drive Her Forward comes into play. Where we really want to Connect women and talk about, uh, you know, we're talking about things of willpower. And I'm not talking willpower of like, don't eat the donut or go to the gym willpower. I'm talking, you know, we're. I've got a lady who has read her last rights on her deathbed, um, sick as a dog, and go from that situation to now she owns her own company and is thriving and successful 15 years later. Okay, so what pulled you out of that, Those deep, dark areas of your life to get to where you are now? That's what I want to know. We talked about women who have, you know, worked in places, and they said they lost their voice. They just lost who they were because they allowed others to manipulate them or work around them or whatever. And they got out of those situations. And about that, they're never going to do that again. So why not bring those experiences to the, to the table and teach maybe the younger generation or just even other. They don't even need to be younger. Some women are going through it today, and how can we help them navigate some of those complexities of being in business? So that's really kind of where I'm going with. Drive her forward with that.

Speaker B: And you're very deliberate about rejecting what you call shallow empowerment and performative ambition. What does that mean to you, and why does it bother you so much?

Speaker A: So that means, um, you know, this is not, ah, you know, girl power, girl boss kind of thing. You know, we can sit and all braid each other's hair and lift, try to talk how wonderful we are to each other, but at the end of the day, still don't think that that drives any kind of forget, uh, leadership, any kind of just personal growth. I really want to get, like I said, get deep down and dirty. And I think, you know, just talking about. People just don't get into stuff. You know, we, we. I feel like women are very easy to, to. They want to talk about what they're going to manifest or what they're. They're grateful for in a day, which I don't begrudge it. I think I do it, but I don't know that it's something that, you know, if. If I tell another female, it's going to do anything for anybody. So, uh, we're, you know, I'm bringing this together. You know, I talked to lady yesterday, and she goes, I'm just tired of the acronyms. I just, uh, like, what is an acronym going to do for me? And it's not going to do anything. And so one thing that I'm very proud of with this community that I'm building is these women are coming in and they are all engaged and they have a voice and they're helping each other. It's not me getting up and pontificating about my experience or what I think or what I feel somebody should say, do, act or whatever. You know, I definitely chime in. But you know, I have my collective of women who are helping each other out and really bringing up the conversations or issues that they want to discuss and where they're at. Um, we have a call next week and I'm bringing in a guest speaker who is Emile. And we're going to just throw back the curtain of. Okay, so in a male perspective, what do you guys think is important for women and leaders? What, what do we need to do to earn that respect? From a male point of view? What turns you guys off in terms of respect or leadership? How can we, how do we navigate this field in a better way? And what do you, what would you look for in a female employee? What, you know, those types of questions and I think those are really going to help somebody move forward in their careers. And I've got a young lady, she's on the sales floor at uh, a Hyundai store and she joined our group because she said, listen, Katie, I want to be more, but I don't know what that means. She goes, I work with all guys and Johnny over here wants to be like Bobby one day and Sam wants to be like Jordan. She goes, I don't know what that means. I, I want to be something, but I don't know who I am trying to emulate. And so she's joined this group who's full of a wide range of, from sales men or sales women to business owners. And there's a wide range there that you can learn from.

Speaker B: Well, I love seeing the, there's a new trend. I mean, there's more women moving into upper leadership in the automotive industry and it's pretty exciting that.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: So who are some of the thought leaders or people that inspire you in this space?

Speaker A: That's a great question and it's one that I struggle with. And I don't know if you want to know, like female or male or anything. I'm a big believer. Like, I love sports and I'm um, big on the Olympics. So my, the people I look up to and admire are the Lindsey Vaughn's and the Simone Biles of the world. They have a blog coming out about it. Here too, on that, where you take those two athletes and Lindsey Von, who, you know, was competing on a tournament ACL that she busted a week before the Olympics, and in her mind and her body, and she had all the conviction of the world that she was going to go do it. Yet here we sit back and criticize and tell ourselves like, well, she's crazy and reckless for even trying to do that. And granted, now she hurt herself, but I'm not convinced that that had anything to do with what she was dealing with, you know. And then you, Simone Biles, who she pulled out of the Olympics because she had the twisties, which, you know, I can relate to. I was a gymnast. And in her mind, she knew that it wasn't safe. She knew that if she went out there and actually tried to perform this, she could seriously injure herself. But then again, here we are. Well, she's not tough enough and she didn't go out there and do it. And so I really just admire these two women and other athletes, but those are two of the top of my list for holding their conviction and holding true to themselves and what they want and what they believe in.

Speaker B: Do you think Lindsey Vaughn will come back? Or is there. Is she done?

Speaker A: You know, that's funny. I was walking with a friend yesterday and we were talking about it, and I am not convinced that that woman is done. I'm really not.

Speaker B: I mean, she has the champion mindset. So, uh, what's the worst thing you consistently have to help women unlearn?

Speaker A: Get out of your own way. Women tend to come up with every excuse not to do something or find every excuse why they can't or. I don't know, I, and I still do it. I say it all the time. And my husband has to remind me all the time that I do it.

Speaker B: I think that most of us, really. We had a men's, uh, night at the church last night, and that was a question, um, who's standing in your way? And I was like, sometimes it's myself. Myself. I've got to get out of my own way. So you've operated across two countries, built a dealership from scratch, launched a women's leadership platform, and you're now advising eight figure transactions through it all. What's the thing that kept you chasing or building toward that connects all of these chapters?

Speaker A: I just want to be better. I'm always continuing to strive. And, you know, it's. Again, I had this conversation with a friend yesterday, too, and she's part of the community and, and she. We Worked together years and years and years ago. And she said, katie, you just always seem to have that mindset of, yeah, you got what's going on today, but you're always thinking ahead to what's next. And I. That's very true. I'm building out Driver Ford. I'm, um, you know, with DSMA and done the dealerships, but I. I still feel like this is a, uh, stepping stone into something new. And I don't know what that is. I have no idea. But I. This isn't the end of the chapter by any means. And every piece of the puzzle. I'm a big believer of everything happens for a reason. And I think Drive her Forward just came at a very opportune time. And I don't think I could have done this 10 years without all of the experience that I went through with the two dealerships and navigating, you know, the two countries and working with DSMA and all the types of personalities I've worked with throughout the years. I think it just kind of makes sense and it's all coming together now. And I don't know. I'm in, um, a. I'm in a phase of my life where I just want to help people. It makes me feel good to help and see these women, you know, move and grow and become bigger and better.

Speaker B: I think I asked you this when I met you. When are you going to write your book?

Speaker A: I don't know, but that's been brought up several times. And, uh, I am working with somebody. When the time is right, she will help me start that process.

Speaker B: So here's one question I always like to end with, and that is, what is Katie Naughton want to be known for?

Speaker A: That's a great question. And I think I just want to be known for that I was a trailblazer, that I was. I did make a difference and that I. I made an impact on people's lives in a positive way, is really what I want to be known for. And I. I always did with my staff. I know I, you know, did it with my dealers at dsma and now I want to do it with my community members and the people I'm working with through Driver Forward.

Speaker B: That's amazing. Well, Katie, you're an absolute rock star and inspiration on what's possible when you follow your dreams. Um, it's been a pleasure to learn your story here today, and the conversation was so good. Um, I just want to thank you for opening up, sharing, and giving us insight into your life as a car dealer. Women's empowerment leader and just all around amazing human being.

Speaker A: Thank you very much. I appreciate it.

Speaker B: Thank you.