Innovation in Motion: The Next Era of Supply Chain

Speaker A: Hello and good afternoon, good evening, good morning to you all from wherever you're joining in from whichever part of the world you're joining in from. This is Jason Abraham. You're seeing me live on NLG Talks podcast with Hisham Sherry. Today, uh, we are going to delve on a wonderful topic today, innovation in motion. The next year of supply chain. All those supply chain fans out there, all, all those who are interested to understand what's the latest development going on in supply chain industry. Um, on a higher level, this podcast is for you and all those professionals who are trying to get into the field of supply chain. Um, you have to listen to this podcast because we are bringing in daily experts from around the world on this particular topic as well. Today Hisham is joining us, uh, uh, to speak on this wonderful topic. Uh, Hisham, good evening to you. Hope you're doing well.

Speaker B: Yeah. Good evening. Good evening Justin, thanks a lot for having me here.

Speaker A: Amazing. Those who don't know Hisham, uh, please would you like to introduce yourself, uh, and then we'll quickly move on to the topic.

Speaker B: Okay, thanks a lot. Okay, so uh, I'm Hisham Suri, I'm supply chain and operation consultant. I'm having more than 20 years uh, in setup and building manufacturing and supply chain systems across uh, several organizations. My most of experience was mainly in the oil and gas which is uh, quite a resilience agile. It brings every, all this kind of interesting topic for the supply chain and uh, with all my over my career I have always focusing on the lean and improving and uh, one of the key parts that I keep focusing on which is related to the topic of today, it's about the technology because I like the team to do their job faster and smarter and I believe that if something can be done with a machine then it should be assigned to the machine so that the human can focus on what really matters.

Speaker A: Absolutely. You mentioned oil and gas and this is the nice uh, time to speak on this particular subject and industry when there is so much of disruption you can see up and down every day. So uh, you mentioned the technology as the base and when it can solve problems you should assign it to the technology and uh, you should help or you should give people to uh, focus on something important or maybe a human touch is required. Uh, let's start. Uh, for those who don't know this, this uh, conversation is based on Hisham's um, article on energy talks Global Digest. I mean Hisham has contributed uh, an article to the Digest, a monthly monthly publication. Uh, you can See the link of that particular publication uh, under the, under this video basically. So uh, we are covering uh, what Hisham really wrote on this particular subject today. And uh, one of the important uh thoughts which, which came up to my mind when I was reading the article uh, in the initial stage was how Hisham has made a framework around technology focusing uh, on how technology can solve problems. Not only solving problems but it can also use uh, it can be also used to solve problems or simplify problems. So my first question to Hisham would be in your experience um, you have seen many tools, many many tools to solve multiple problems. What is those, those tools? I mean you can name any tool which is the most underutilized tool you feel. I know that you have mentioned that in the article itself. But then for those who have not seen uh that article, would you like to share something on that?

Speaker B: Sure, let me step do one step back first. I think today we are defining technology uh, wrong most of the topic whenever you speak about technology everyone it come to his mind it is all about the digital solution, the AI, the automation etc. But that's not the right definition. And as someone who's coming with the from the quality um uh industry uh when you define a technology it's any scientific knowledge that has been converted into a solution that help to increase the human capability. Okay so this one is not only restricted for the digital solution. In my article uh, I try to list the three main pillars of technology that can shape it. Sometimes the technology, it's the framework itself. You come up with an, you know with, with a scientific knowledge and you put it together and you come have the scientific knowledge for a framework like you do it like a six Sigma. It's a technology, it's a framework, it's helped to solve the problem. It brings solution to the industry. Uh, or it could be physical like the barcode, the RFID technologies, the uh, uh, wearable glass, digital glass. And of course the third part is the digital part which is here coming the AI and automation. Now coming back to your question about the underutilized tool. I even use it underutilized. I didn't know about it. It's the Microsoft Planner. Microsoft Planner is one of the hidden tool within the Microsoft 365 that no one even know what it is today. What is the biggest software overwhelmed the supply chain team is Outlook is the emails. Okay, everybody within with easy with his email. Even a manager talking to his team he's using the email. But now the traceability is very hard because this email Is get the same mailbox join from a freight forwarder quotation the supplier, the uh communication department the HR announcement. So find the email you ready to spend at the time. In the Microsoft Planner you move from communicate in terms of a text to assign a task. Okay so you have it like a dashboard. So a team can assign a task from their to their manager. The manager can assign the task to his team so that every day and with a due date correct. And then you can have it having all the same functionality of the Outlook. Like you can uh put the time the date you can attach this one and every action you do it in the planner. It's already uh reflected by a notification email that this task has been assigned to you. So you can refer to the email if you are a fan of the email. And recently it's been uh under uh beta version frontier for Copilot. Now Copilot can go and read your outlook and then check any actions plan that is expected and it automatically create for you the uh the the the task in your plan. The good into this planner is that you can have it in a bucket like a Kanban board. Correct this one for freight forwarder I have for inventory. So it helped the team to only let's keep the Outlook for external uh communication and keep the internal from whatever tool that we can all have access to.

Speaker A: Right. I have used Microsoft Planner. I feel that it's. It's a alternative slack. Uh maybe it can be an alternative to slap Slack when you can also chat with your team members. You can send messages, you can assign the tasks uh to your team members. It helps a lot um those who are subscribing. Although I mean many companies, many people subscribe to Microsoft 365 as a package and uh they get everything in that but they just use Outlook or maybe they just use the Microsoft Word and PowerPoint for some some extent. So do you think that people are under utilizing the whole package or uh. They are actually not caring about this particular app. Microsoft Planner.

Speaker B: Yeah, in quality we we have always learned one thing. We have to blame the process. Okay. There is no people to blame. Okay. The process should be what is the problem happening today in the organization. It is not communicating what is the tools that is available. They don't have an awareness. Okay.

Speaker A: Right.

Speaker B: So we cannot say people are underutilized. I I don't know that this tool is available. So it's the role of the it plus the uh team leader and the uh the manager who is using to explore if there is something we can do it. I mean subscribing to the uh, Twitter, uh, channel of Microsoft or subscribing to the YouTube channel of Microsoft. It's enough to get you to let you know that there is a something called Microsoft Planner. It's working like this and how to use it. This is today one of the things that we have to be aware. The technology is moving very fast. You have no choice rather than to. You need to subscribe to those kind of communication news channel from the technology provider.

Speaker A: And do you see that uh, there is a gap between uh, people understanding the technology and actually the company taking an initiative to upskill. Ah, I would say upskill their employees with the latest tools and development. Or is it like uh, there is a lot of information but we are not using it?

Speaker B: No, there is a. It's not well introduced I would say. I mean the information is there but today, uh, many of the things today this is also what the things that I started to uh, talk about it recently is that uh, people are using the tool without understanding what it is for in the first place. Correct. Like I have seen a cases like company has invested in AI and training and using the technology. But all the application is for a bi, not for an AI for example. Okay. So the people need to spend it understanding the technology. Basically the way I look at it, you cannot use Microsoft project if you don't understand basics of project management. Okay.

Speaker A: Absolutely.

Speaker B: As simple as a. Simple as that.

Speaker A: Right. You mentioned process, uh, bypassing process intelligence in your um, article. Would you like to share something? Because uh, you have you focused on supply chain digital transformations failing due to bypassing the process intelligence. Would you like to share something on that?

Speaker B: Yeah, of course today according to Gartner, the 70% of the project it's fail. Okay. The problem is that uh, even today the biggest uh software you need to have a sequence. Uh, so in this world we have a physics to step one by one, I mean the AI and going to this level it's an augmented of what you are doing. Okay. But if you don't have what you are doing well declared then you cannot augment it or you will augment something wrong faster. Like, like Bill gets a say. If you have a waste in your process, you just have it as a digitized. Okay, you still have the waste but you bring it to the your digital uh, work process intelligence. Here it's meaning that you need to look at it, uh, you need to describe it well, you need to make sure to remove all the unnecessarily uh double entries. So really take it to the lean and optimize it and smooth it and make sure that you map it. We're using the simple framework of a quality for troubleshooting the problem that is called cpoc. Supplier input, process output customer. By the end of the process intelligence project you should end up to understand who is key, what, where and when. If you don't have this initial phase your continuous when you go in the project there will be problem happen. You will not be able to trace back where is this problem. And this framework helped me a lot when I was working to develop the BI dashboard. I map all the process, I make the cpu. So I have to understand so in the future whenever there is an error in the dashboard I could know exactly where it happened from which entry in the ERP and who is behind it. Okay. According to the process map. So if you don't do this kind of infrastructure first, you will not be able uh to implement the technology. Now there is another big trap here. You maybe even end up to use the wrong technology like the case I bring about it. Correct. So it may be that your technology that you needed, it's an automation. It's not an AI, it's not a bi, it's an automation. This is the gap I have discovered with one of my customer. Everything he explained to me Microsoft Access is all what he needs. That's the technology is right for him. As simple as that? Yes, it can be as simple as that. He don't need to go to the rp, he has only five users, his transaction is very limited. So Microsoft Access is the ideal technology. If you don't do the process intelligence you will not be able to select the right technology.

Speaker A: Right. And the uh, technology. Do you feel that because you've worked in Malaysia, worked in uh, UAE and across the GCC as well, you've been advising SMEs as well. How, how is it different from different geographical perspectives? Do you see there is technology growth in Malaysia or maybe GCC is far ahead. Would you like to share some insights on that?

Speaker B: I think when it coming to the technologies availability, let's uh. Today I think it's become available. Okay. The technology, it's become accessible, it's become available today we can see with the AI when they roll out a new function, they maybe start with some region first but it gets definitely cascading what you have. It is like sometimes maybe there is some agent of this technology available in your country and sometimes the agent who are providing the technology may be not uh Existing but I think today it's become accessible. Everything can be done remotely. You don't need really somebody to come to your place to, to uh, do the setup. I mean the technology even has helped us to remove the barrier of really the availability of the on site uh, support unless for of course a physical devices and machines and equipment. Yes, that could be. Instead of. You are going to call the service company. They will come next today because they are in your country. They may be coming after 10 days because they need to somebody send somebody uh, overseas. But even for this kind today, now we have this new uh, with the eye glass, with the digital, you know, you can, they can connect directly from the center and the headquarter. They can tell you okay, show us what is in your uh, electronic room. We need to tell you. They will tell. They can even guide, guide uh, you remotely. So even this technology has helped us a lot for this part.

Speaker A: Yeah, the ar, the VR technology is fabulous. And um, yeah, um, there is a shift in the supply chain industry uh, towards um, I would say um, transformation in the technology field. And the supply chain is very, I mean it's moving fast. You can see, you can feel that people have to upgrade their skills. People have to really learn. Uh, AI. I'm not asking you the question, the basic question which people are asking will AI replace jobs? But I would rather reframe that. Uh, how efficient or how should we as professionals upskill ourselves uh, so that we could actually catch up with the transformation. It's very important to catch up with the transformation. Uh, do you have any tips for professionals out there? As a consultant?

Speaker B: Yeah, as a first, let me go back to your uh, statement about A.I. will the A.I. take my job? And this kind of statement that we keep hearing in every AI conference. Uh, AI will not replace you, but somebody who know, uh, AI will do. In fact, even when you look into this one, this statement, I will rephrase it to somebody who know how to integrate technology in the business model, okay. Will even replace the person who know AI. Okay, so if you bring to the company solution with the AI, but somebody else bring the solution, the right technology that is faster, cheaper, he will be the winner. Not because of your no AI. So it's not uh, through this is. I don't agree a lot with this seismic look today. Uh, I think we need to run behind. I am for example, I have to be from every two weeks I need to sit down on Google new uh, blogs, read what's happening. It is really moving fast. You need to first select uh. I don't need you to select my recommendation. Do not overwhelmed with so many to follow so many channels because the technology is going to be the same. I mean this time we uh heard about nanobana was the top in images. Now uh, image two coming from. But the technology of creating an image from AI this is what you need to know. Google is a very good starting point. Uh, you should be uh taking sometimes those uh software developer they issue the courses that it is quick it you can finish it within one hour. From one to five hours. Go ahead and push yourself to learn. The technology is really moving faster. Okay. The third thing that will keep you is that when you open the tool always let your eye see if there is any additional button has been added. Okay. What it is this one for? Ah, uh, there. What's this options. Oh, they add notebook inside Gemini now. Okay, what's this one? Let me search about it. Put yourself with a curiosity that you always do not let you open the window. You go strictly to the chatbot. You enter your question and you exit without notice. So this is like you enter your home, they have changed the furniture. But you just straight away go to your bed, you sleep, next day you come out. You didn't even see that they. They changed the furniture around you. So try to have this type of curiosity to explore what are the new functions that has been added to the interface that I am uh seeing it. Yeah. By keeping this one and uh. Keeping uh engagement follow uh magazines like the energy talks. I think it brings experience. All these things will help definitely you uh, to keep you updated with the. With the technology.

Speaker A: Yeah, I mean the information which is available we should be able to understand. You mentioned nicely that um, the extensions, the integrations, even Claude is coming up with a lot of development these days. It's not about just uh chatting and getting the uh feedback. It's about uh, seeing what it's connected hyperlink to. Uh, before closing up today's session, um, very important question which comes up to everyone's mind. Um, would be that if there is a transformation in companies, who should change first? Is it the people? Is it the process or the technology? What changes first?

Speaker B: That's a good question. If you change the process, but the people will not understand it. It will not work right. If you bring technology but people do not know how to use it, it's a waste of time and money. So the answer will go always that you should consider the people. This is one of the new excellence. And for me it's really a technology framework. About the Shingo model. Shingo has becoming uh. Shingu. Dr. Shingu was the consultant of Toyota. And he's the one who is behind the lean of Toyota and everything in Toyota they focus on the most important is the people. Okay. If the people understand that well, you can improve the technology, you can improve the process, you can integrate the technology. And then you can able to see the. The. The value without the people. Because also you need to understand if you bring a technology that it is too much complex or the level of the people. There is no. There is no point. I have heard the name at uh. During one of the exhibition big companies they told me we do have more than. I don't know ten tools. Uh. It tell us, but we don't know what it is. Imagine all this is a subscription are paid. So it is not people do not know about it. And this is same things back like we talk about Microsoft 365. Correct. So no one is talking about it. But if you don't tell the people and you try to understand what is their needs. Do really they need this one and do not. Please. One of the things is that do not push the technology if your system doesn't need it or if your people cannot adapt it. Okay? This is not shy. There is nothing is wrong. At the end of the day. You need to make sure the business is working and there is a people who are running make your businesses running. Correct. So they need to feel comfortable with the use of the technology. Need to feel comfortable when you are doing the process. Do not make them overlooking and uh. Repeating keeping uh. Rotating around themselves those kind of things. And also sometimes is the fact you need to understand the environment where you are working. So different countries, different setup. You cannot just copy and past. You have to respect the. The environment, the culture. This is all of the things it need to be considered with the. The. The. The uh. The environment. And also what One of the things when you took. One of the reason of the project failure is that they do not involve these people in the project. They. They work the project in silo and then later. But you should involve the people. Let the people feel I was contributing to these solutions. I was invited, I was participated to give my opinion. He will also feel uh. Loyal. He will be feeling motivated to give more ideas. You need more ideas. Okay. Uh. Otherwise it will. It will not work.

Speaker A: Absolutely. So people uh. Is the framework I would say is the base for development. And uh. If people don't change, there is a resistance. Do you feel resistance when you bring transformations in company.

Speaker B: Your question is all good. I cannot find. Ah, yes. Resistance will be existing. Correct. Uh, that's why you should. You cannot use the standardized. One of the. Of the key skill that you will. I starting to think about it that I feel it's been. Nobody look at it in the supply chain is communication. We, we just assume the people will understand me. I just uh, uh, so I'm talking to an old guy like an audience to a younger. So I'm. I'm using the same language. I'm using team wording and I'm assuming the people will understand me. And later on we got frustrated. At the end we say oh, uh, I. Why the team is not working. Okay.

Speaker A: That's dangerous.

Speaker B: So I think today we have to. It's uh, a chapter by the way, in the project management framework. Okay. It has a chapter completely about communication. You should know. We should know how to communicate. That's the only way for you to remove the resilience. People will be resilient because you give them a vague, uh, picture and you left them and go. Then they say sorry, I will not do it. I don't know. I don't want to waste my time. I will use my Excel file. I'm happy with it. Okay. Uh, then let them introduce it. You need to use the communication. You need to simplify the information for them. If you don't use a communication skill and this meaning different level. You need a different communication. You need to select your audience. Correct. So different level of. Of passing the information. If you are explaining to the worker who's in the machine near the manufacturing line is different from the uh, specialist is different from the managers, directors. So your message will be different. You cannot just having the same presentation PowerPoint and you keep. Show it to everybody on the organization and you tick. Okay, I have communicated about this. My project. I'm done. It's not. It will not. That's will the resistances happen. People will tell you moving their head.

Speaker A: Yes.

Speaker B: And at the end of the day, we don't know even what are you talking about.

Speaker A: Absolutely. And they should be empowered to take decisions also.

Speaker B: Yes. This is what the shingle model is. Um is. Is took it. There is one pillar of the um if of the shingle model even you should check during the audit whether a man, a leader has a step back in whose opinion. Because the worker opinion is much better for the organization. So this is. They call it lead with humility. It's like you need to make sure that it's okay for you. There is Nothing wrong. Yes, I give an idea. But the worker or the person who is next to the line, his idea is better. I think we should go with his idea. That's, that's the better for the company not to keep only my idea. No, it's coming from my side. Uh, how come? Uh, no, definitely he's wrong. No, give him the chance. This is why Toyota has become the top. Because they give the floor to every uh, uh, person in the line and they hear. Okay, so Dr. Shingo always say we have uh, in the Gamba walk, you have a two ears to hear and you have only uh, one mouse to talk. So you should hear more from the people, listen to their problem, try to address it. And uh, try to give them the opportunity to take their idea forward with the management. And if it works, give them back a reward. Tell them, let them proud in front of their team, with their colleagues that their idea has worked, it's been proven and it's become now an ideal methodology and process that is being implemented by the company.

Speaker A: Yeah. And that's a very important part you mentioned. Let them also know that your idea has been taken and it has been implemented. M. That's a gap in many organization. I feel that that idea is taken through a survey or something and then it's. They fail to communicate that boss, your idea has been taken. This has been implemented. I think that's a great statement.

Speaker B: Yeah, that's, that's the Shingo model excellence. Okay. It's really brilliant model. That Shingo model is. Look 2D. Uh, it's first, you cannot go for the shingle if you don't have lean first. You need to at least basics. The lean to make the culture is already there. But the shingle model will protect the improvement. They wanted to engage everyone, um, inside the company so that they are able to contribute to the mission goal. So every worker inside the Shingo model organization, he know why I'm. Why what I'm going to do today and how I'm contributing to the revenue of the organization. How I'm contributing to the adding value to my customer. If every. Imagine every worker like that, he has these things, it will be uh, another, Another level. Correct. And what I'm telling you is not a theory. Correct. There is a, uh, real case called Numi New Me happened in the U.S. correct. Ford, when they are a uh, single motor. Sorry. They give one factory that is losing money to Toyota. This factory has exceed all the other gm. Okay. And when they send someone to know what's happening, this guy tried to break the system, he couldn't. Any mistake. He do. Every one, you know, and every hand is giving to each other. There is no. This, uh, is not my job. This is not my responsibility. They are all contributing to the big mission. And they say there is no way to break the system. This system is unbreakable. And there is no wonder with the numbers of the revenue that has been achieved by Toyota for the Nummi factory. Uh,

Speaker A: yeah. So it's a great conversation, um, and, uh, thank you so much, uh, for the 30 minutes of amazing wisdom you've shared with Energy talks and the community. We started off with technology, and we are ending up with, um, uh, lean 5s frameworks. And uh, one more area where I wanted to talk about is sustainability that will keep for the, uh, next time, because that's another area of, uh, conversation. Sustainability in supply chain. So, uh, thank you, Hisham, uh, for your time in between your, uh, in between your busy schedules. Thank you so much. How can people reach you? Uh, on LinkedIn. It's.

Speaker B: It's LinkedIn, I think you, you, you mentioned already in your pages. Yes, they are free to, uh, contact, connect with me on LinkedIn, and I'm really more than happy to share, uh, uh, any update or any news with them.