GWP Podcast · 2025-11-16 · 1h 30m
Key moments - from our scoring
Substance score
58 / 100
Five dimensions, 20 points each
Dr. Maryam Mardkhe brings chemistry expertise from a decade in automotive and lithium-ion battery formulation to challenge how the beauty industry markets products. At Stir Lab, her hands-on cosmetics-making workshop, customers extract oils from California almonds, lavender, and cocoa butters before formulating their own serums and lipsticks - experiencing transparency at every step. She dismantles the "natural vs. chemical" dichotomy that dominates beauty marketing: all matter is chemical, she explains, so the real distinction is least-processed versus synthetic compounds that don't exist in nature. Drawing on her Iranian heritage - where rose distillation and perfume originated a thousand years ago - Mardqhe blends traditional ingredients like black seed oil with biotech actives, rejecting the trend toward facial transformation and promoting acceptance of natural aging. The episode addresses why large players like Unilever and Estée Lauder haven't yet built experiential, educational models like Stir Lab, and explores the gap between what brands tell consumers and what chemists actually know about long-term safety of synthetic dyes and colorants in daily-use products.
All matter contains chemicals; the real distinction is between least-processed ingredients (like cold-pressed oils) and synthetic chemicals that don't exist in nature (like certain dyes). Chemical doesn't inherently mean bad, and natural doesn't mean good - castor oil, for example, is natural but can be toxic.
Testing takes years, and many synthetic dyes and colorants have been used for years before being banned once risks emerge. Because nobody has studied what 1% synthetic material does to your body long-term, Mardkhe prefers least-processed formulations that rely on chemistry existing in nature.
Customers start with raw ingredients (almonds from California farms, lavender, cocoa butters, oils, and wax), extract oils themselves, select active ingredients based on their skin concern (pigmentation, wrinkles, or hydration), and create personalized products like serums or lipsticks while controlling the richness, color, and scent.
Large brands have historically sold packaged products without transparency, but Gen Z demands knowledge and experience alongside products. Major players like Unilever and Estée Lauder are aware they need to shift but haven't yet implemented experiential models at scale.
Iran has a thousand-year history of rose distillation, perfume, and poetry; her grandmother and ancestors used least-processed ingredients like black seed oil for skincare, and she blends these traditional, cultural ingredients with advanced biotech actives in her products.
Our reviewer’s read on each dimension, with quotes from the episode.
The episode contains genuine educational content about cosmetics chemistry, the natural vs. synthetic distinction, and formulation science. However, it's diluted by extended personal anecdotes, philosophical tangents about beauty/wealth definitions, and conversational padding. The core insights about synthetic chemicals, preservative necessity, and ingredient transparency are valuable but occupy maybe 40-45% of the runtime.
Chemical doesn't mean bad, natural doesn't mean good
nobody has studied what that 1% synthetic material do to your body in the long term
The guest offers a useful reframing of 'natural vs. chemical' terminology and makes smart points about ingredient transparency and experiential product creation. However, the core thesis - that consumers should understand what goes into beauty products and that big brands are missing the personalization trend - is well-trodden in wellness discourse. The Stir Lab model itself is moderately novel but not groundbreaking.
the way we use natural and chemical is misleading
the big companies know the new generation they need to experience but they haven't stepped forward to make it work yet
Dr. Mardkhe has legitimate credentials: a PhD in chemistry, 10 years in R&D and formulation at scale (automotive lithium-ion batteries), academic teaching experience, and hands-on operational expertise building and running Stir Lab. She is a practitioner-founder, not a career podcast guest. However, she is still early-stage (founded Stir Lab in 2024) and hasn't achieved significant scale, which limits the seniority rating somewhat.
I moved to the States in 2009 to go to grad school, get my PhD in chemistry
I started working in corporate for about like 10 years, being a formulation chemist in automotive industry, lithium ion battery
While the guest mentions specific ingredients (beeswax, mica, castor oil, retinol, vitamin C) and real regulatory moves (EU retinol restrictions, FDA banning aldehyde-releasing ingredients), the episode lacks concrete data on market dynamics, customer metrics, or Stir Lab's own performance. The $122B natural cosmetics projection is cited but not interrogated. No specific numbers on Stir Lab revenue, customer acquisition, unit economics, or market share are discussed.
natural cosmetics, you know, 2025 is projected to derive 55 billion 2025, but by 2034, it's supposed to be 122 billion
European organization, they started to say, oh, you know, it's vitamin A and it's. If you use it three times a day, you get more than what you need, vitamin A in your body. You should not go more than 0.3% of the retinol
The host asks decent foundational questions and shows curiosity, but rarely pushes back or interrogates assumptions. When the guest makes broad claims (e.g., 'big brands don't understand Gen Z'), the host nods along rather than probing. The host's own extended personal story late in the episode (about working out, Ghana, wealth definition) feels self-indulgent and eats airtime. Limited genuine follow-ups or productive disagreement.
Yeah. Yeah.
Wow. So much education that you just dropped right there.
Computed from the transcript - who did the talking, and the words that came up most.
This episode explores the intersection of beauty, science, and wealth through the story of Dr. Maryam Mardkhe, founder of Stirbar Lab - a zero-waste, sustainable beauty lab where ancient rituals meet modern chemistry. Maryam’s journey begins in a land rich with poetry and art - where the first rose distillation took place over a thousand years ago - and evolves into a mission to redefine how we experience beauty today. She brings a rare blend of scientific precision and artistic spirit, showing how chemistry can become a creative language for self-expression, sustainability, and empowerment. At the heart of this conversation is a bold question: What if wealth wasn’t just about accumulation - but about creation, connection, and care?
Transcribed and scored by The B2B Podcast Index.
Speaker A: The way we use natural and chemical is misleading. Chemical doesn't mean bad, natural doesn't mean good. So it's like we should not use it. I would say least process if you want to go real, real natural. It means, oh, I pick the mango from the tree, I cut it and put on my face. That's like the raw way of doing it. But when you say I don't want to use any chemical, it's a wrong word. I would say synthetic chemical that is not available in the nature. So we make something that doesn't exist in nature and we our product like some of the dyes as a color. But beauty is 100% related to health. You put that on every day. Some people, they put it like three times a day. Nobody has studied what that 1% synthetic material do to your body in the long term.
Speaker B: Hey there. So thanks for tuning in to a new episode of gwp. So this is an episode where I talk to Miriam, who is a formulation chemist. On the episode I talk about how I met Miriam. I met her at an event when we were both on a panel. I'm super excited to share this episode with you because Miriam has a company called Stir Lab where people are able to come to her lab and make their own cosmetics. I mean, when you think about the cosmetics industry, it's a multibillion dollar industry. From Hailey Bieber to Kylie Jenner. People are becoming billionaires, be billionaires overnight from these products. But people are also suffering from number one, finding the right product and even getting the right information. What Miriam provides on this episode is solely information based and education forward. She's educating you about your skincare routines, why she started Stir Lab, her origin and even some some of the endeavors that she's faced as an entrepreneur, a woman entrepreneur on this journey. I hope you enjoyed the episode. I hope you find it very, very useful and insightful. And if you do, be sure to share with a friend or someone that needs to hear something like this. I appreciate you for tuning in, M. And as always, thanks for being a part of this journey. Peace and joy. All right. Welcome to a new episode of gwp. Super excited for this episode. Obviously I'm always excited for a new episode, but I think this one is gonna be definitely special. Thinking of how we met and you know, how excited I am and how excited you are for this conversation. Super excited to have you on gwp. Miriam.
Speaker A: Thank you so much for inviting me. I was super excited. I'm like, I have to go see Papa and I be On a podcast with him.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Thank you.
Speaker B: Yeah, thank you so much. I appreciate it. And you know, if you've been following this podcast, you know, our goal is to bring you relevant information. And so when I meet people that have the right information, the right experience, the right time also is really important. When I, When I find people like that, I'm always excited to bring them to the podcast. So taking it back to where we met, uh, we met at a fashion show slash gala slash tech event where we were both on a panel. Uh, we spoke at that, at that event. Event was amazing, and we connected. And that's when I learned about what you're doing, which is with Stir Lab, an amazing initiative that you've taken. But you didn't start with Stir Lab. You started from somewhere and then now you're running Stir Lab. So tell us about your journey.
Speaker A: Okay. Yeah. So, um, actually I moved to the States in 2009 to go to grad school, get my, uh, PhD in chemistry. And I started, um, working in incorporate for about like 10 years, being a formulation chemist in, um, automotive industry, lithium ion battery. And, um, then, um, 20, um, 24. I decided to have my own, um, you know, company. And uh, my daughter initiated that when she was asking about like, mommy, I want to go buy a, ah, lipstick. And I'm like, okay, let's go. And I'm reading all these ingredients in the back and no, I'm not letting you buy anything. I'm going to design and build a whole lab for you and you can make that in my lab. So, um, yeah, so I started with completely different, uh, industry. And then I spent a year learning about like, um, skin care and beauty product. And I educated myself and I completely pivot to a different, um, category and carrying all the expertise I had from my experience. So that's, uh, that's where I am now.
Speaker B: Yeah, that's really exciting. I'm really fascinated that your daughter was kind of the, uh, you know, the, the starting point of all of this. And so you went to school to be, um, a chemist. Right. Um, what are some of the surprising things you learned, like, throughout that journey that most people that use some of these products that we use now don't know, and they should know.
Speaker A: Yeah. So, um, so the reason the, um, cerebral lab exists is I wanted people to know about ingredients that goes into their product. And they don't just trust on the marketing and what is labeled on the back of the product. So as a chemist, so I understand that, but just ordinary people when they come in they just read, um, the label and they say, oh, it's, you know, it's vegan. It's cruelty free. These are all like, uh, buzzwords. And they say, oh, so I trust and I buy. But as a chemist, when I say like, oh, it's vegan, I go in the back and I say, oh, it's vegan. Because beeswax is out, synthetic waxes in. So that doesn't correlate with me. Like, it's like, no for me. So, um, when people come to my lab, they have the options. We have beeswax, we have wax from plants. But it has been through a very exciting, a safe process. So I transfer my education that I learned in a really simple way to a very ordinary customer.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So, um, that's, that's what I doing. And um, from the whole chemistry year at school, I realized that, uh, beside making things, everything has to be really transparent. Where does it come from and how is it made? And um, so that whole process made me to replicate in the lab that I just designed that everything from raw ingredient all the way to product has to be very transparent.
Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. Speaking of transparency, you know, I think the beauty industry, and before the cameras started rolling, I think we started talking about this. But the beauty industry is ubiquitous. It's huge. And the growth trajectory is even bigger. But there are these big players in the beauty industry, you know, like the Unilever, the Estee Lauders of the world and so on. And are they like some sort of like gatekeeping that they do to make sure someone like you that's providing people with natural products is not able to essentially either educate people or even penetrate that market.
Speaker A: So, um, I don't know, hundred years, the way we buy beauty product is we go to store and buy it, any product.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And then even like food.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But then people realize processed food and they started to go, okay, I buy my own banana. And what, I want to make my own smoothie. Instead of just going, uh, by a pre made, um, you know, juice or smoothie on the shelf.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But it didn't happen over time, so it's just recent. Yeah. So people used to buy everything packaged in the box, but now people are more shifted to more organic. I want to know what's in the product and I want to make it, I think same for the beauty, um, industry. Even myself, I have always been, um, you know, buying, um, beauty product cosmetic from store. But it's really different way of thinking now to buy product. It's experience behind it that I think Gen Z and all new generation really into it. They are not now buying, they need the knowledge. And, um, that knowledge would be best if they have at the same time the experience. So if you get the knowledge, why you're making something.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: That you empower them. They have the experience, they get the knowledge. So it's completely different way of the big brands that the way they sell, you know, the product, it's a little bit slower.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But, uh, I think it's, uh, more useful for the next generation, you know. So, um, I think health wise, mental wise. So I think it's completely different approach. But, uh, people might, some of them might say, oh, it's really, it's a nice idea. But some say, oh, you know, you can't have, you need to have branches in all cities to make it possible. But that's my goal.
Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A: I'm like, yeah, I want to do that. I want to have branch in every city. People come and make their own. Not mixing things, extracting, do chemistry.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And, um, but the big companies, like, they have thought about this, that new generation, they need to experience.
Speaker B: Yes.
Speaker A: So they are thinking about it, but they haven't stepped forward to make it work. But it's, it's out there. So they know they have to shift, pivot. But nobody has that done that yet.
Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. And there are a lot of things about this industry that people need that I was learning about, you know, getting ready for the podcast. That has still not been done yet, and I'm super excited to dive into that stuff. But what I want to talk about right now is, you know, if someone is listening to the podcast, you know, most people know our focus, uh, is to provide information that helps people to build wealth. Right. So someone might be wondering, you know, I mean, how does wealth connect to this conversation that we're having right now? I think there's a correlation there. Right. Because health is wealth, and wealth is not just about money. Right. It's also about how you feel, you know, where you live, what you're, you know, the kind of product you even use for your skin, for example, or even the kind of food that you're, you're able to eat. So there's a, there's a nice correlation there that I think people should, you know, be able to be able to think about. So let's, um, let's dive into this a little more and talk about Stella and the processes that goes on behind the scene to then allow people to actually create products that are from natural ingredients, literally ingredients that they're able to see. So when I was learning about what you do at Stir Lab, I saw it's a four step process, a really simple four step process that people go through at the lab. And then at the end they have their own product. Can you talk about that process?
Speaker A: Yeah. So, um, so if you go to store and, um, you buy lotion that is say, oh, it's almond oil lotion with all these actives. So if someone wants to make something in the lab. So I have the almond in my lab, just the almond that I purchased from the farm in California. And I know how they start growing when they pick it. So we start extracting the oil from that, uh, almond.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And then I say, oh, okay. So we want to make, uh, the face serum. We also need to add this oil from the plant. So I have lavender. We extract the lavender. So the process is basically very raw ingredients, uh, raw plants, raw nuts, beans, cocoa, so butters, oil and wax. And then, um, based on what they need, um, we add active ingredient. People come say, you know, I want active ingredient for my, uh, pigmentation, or I want for a, uh, wrinkle, or some people are like, you know, I don't want anything except hydration. So we go very simple. But, um, it goes color cosmetic all the way to skincare products. So people come to have fun, just make lipstick. So they extract their oil, they extract the wax, they mix, they check the color they want, they keep adding pigments. Yeah. So that's, uh, that's the whole process. Like, they are the creator in my lab and I help them, but they are the one decide, like, how much oil, how much richness of the oil they want on their skin, um, what color, what scent. So they all is their responsibility to make a decision which is really beautiful to see.
Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. Just having that control on what goes into the product. Would you say beauty is sort of the new form of wealth creation?
Speaker A: Yeah. Um, like to me, um, if they tell me, oh, I'll give you $1 million today, but, uh, your life is over tomorrow, I'm like, oh, okay, so then I need that life. Yeah. So that life, which is healthy life, is the wealth. Yes. So before I get to that money, I think I need to have that healthy life. And if someone tells me, you know, you're gonna, you can't, uh, breathe regularly for the next 50 years, but you can live 120 years, that's not gonna work too. So any healthy life.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And a long span is like a goal. And then from the beauty perspective, so there are so many ingredients that hasn't, um, been tested it for the long term use. So it takes longer time to figure out it's not good for your body. So we start using them and we start banning them. So um, the reason I want to go natural is, um, so I have to clear that first. Natural and chemical. Chemical in chemistry means any chemical component is chemical. So even the natural apple that you pick from the tree has chemical compound into it. But the minimum process make it stay in a raw form. And the least change once it's go to the process, once you pick the apple, it goes bad. So if all the chemistry changes, you get the juice, you put it in the fridge, you take it out, add the sugar. These are all like changing the whole chemistry of um, apple. And um, so the way we use natural and chemical is misleading. So is, um, chemical doesn't mean bad, natural doesn't mean good. So it's like, um, we should not use it. I would say least processed. So if you want to go real, real natural it means, oh, I picked, um, I don't know, the mango from the tree, I cut it and put on my face. That's like the raw way of doing right. But, um, when you say I don't want to use any chemical, it's a wrong word. I would say synthetic, um, chemical that is not available in the nature. So we make something that doesn't exist in nature and we add to our product, like some of the dyes, uh, as a color. But beauty is 100% related to health. You put that on every day. Some people, they put it like three times a day. So, um, nobody has studied what that 1% synthetic, uh, material do to your body in the long term.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So, um, that's why I'm trying to avoid that. And then I don't want to see in 10 years, 15 years, they say, oh, you know, let's just ban this dye 5 because not good for you. Yeah, but it takes time. Testing takes time. So, um, but if I do just a very natural way of making my beauty product, then, um, I feel like, um, more safe that, oh, you know, this chemistry exists in the nature. So uh, my body would accept that better than something that is just not out there.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Yeah.
Speaker B: Wow. So much education that you just dropped right there. Because I think even, even myself, I associate good with natural. Right. And then when I hear chemical, um, I'm like, oh, it's not that good.
Speaker A: No, no, no. This is just the stolen word from chemistry. Word chemical doesn't mean Bad. It means stuff. Yeah, Chemical. Everything has chemistry and chemical into it. The whole universe. So, uh, we should not separate. Yeah. But even I can say something natural that is toxic, like, um, castor oil. The shelf, um, around the, um, bin is I can make racing and basically kill an animal or someone. You know, it's just that, like, toxic, it's natural.
Speaker B: Right.
Speaker A: But like I'm saying, so it's not always, hey, chemical is bad and natural is good. But I would say least process the way you make juice. Like, do you like to make a juice fresh, or do you want to buy a juice that has been made two months ago with preservative, you know?
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So it's at the end, it's juice, but different way of process.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And different way. Oh, what kind of, uh, fruit they use? Is it from the farm, uh, that they pick this year, or the fruit is, um, you know, they pick it from, like, a month ago.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So these are all matters, if you want to go into detail.
Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. And I hope we're going to be able to get into as much detail as possible on the podcast. But thank you so much for breaking that misconception. I think, um, only a few minutes into the podcast and you're already debunking some of these myths, so thank you so much. So I definitely want to take a step back and talk about your upbringing. Are, uh, there certain parts of your upbringing that made you very interested in. In beauty? Because you're, you're from Iran, right? And I think when I think of Iran, I think of really nice architecture and nice buildings and stuff like that. You know, they're very artsy out there. Are there parts of your upbringing that kind of, you know, made you very interested in, you know, beauty? Is it like, you know, do they rely more on natural, um, ingredients out there, less processed since now we're a little more educated. Right. Do they rely more on less processed ingredients out there for their food, for their skin and stuff like that? Or are those things that influenced you growing up that has got you to this point to start sterlab?
Speaker A: So I grew up in, um, the place that poetry is big, art is big. Uh, the first distillation of rose crafted thousand years ago out there. So perfume started out there in Middle East. So, um, it's. It's a rich culture in history back there. So I'm also bringing that into, for example, my face serum that I'm launching soon. So I'm blending the, um, advanced biotech ingredients with cultural ingredients that has been used for thousands of years. So, yeah, my grandma, like, always said, oh, you know, I'm using, um, this black seed. This does all these, um, good things to your skin. My mom, my grandma's mom, they all use that for many generations. So I'm bringing that and I'm mixing that with the advanced biotech ingredients. Um, so, yes, definitely, the way I grow up, um, we. We always cook food. We always use everything, um, natural, less processed, or like, um, like, my grandma was like, oh, you need glycerin, you need lemon. Let's make this. So I grew up in the culture that everything, you know, um, like my grandma's recipe and all of that, but the poetry is also big. The way I'm introducing poetry into my product is also another thing. So, like, because I'm having the online shopping.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So that's going to bring the whole culture that I grew up with. Yeah. With, um, my product. But the way I grew up. Yes, definitely. Yeah. Um, and when I realized the damask grows, I thought it's from Bulgaria, but no, it's from Middle East.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And I'm like, okay. So the way it was advertised, I never thought, like, oh, it was growing out there. It was first crafted out there.
Speaker B: Interesting.
Speaker A: Then, um, the first perfume was out, um, in that region.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So then I became like, oh, my God. So we always say French, Italian, and we never say, like, Middle Eastern.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So, but I'm trying to see if I can blend these two together.
Speaker B: Absolutely. The heritage is important. Yeah. So how are you blending poetry with what you're building at still app?
Speaker A: Um, so it's more about, like, um, the poems, like, from Rumi that, uh, beauty is everywhere, but you just need to walk into garden to see it. So it's like stair bar, like, for me is like a garden. Like, uh, the beauty is everywhere. We just have to go hands on. And it's not just the ingredient, it's the experience. It's the feel, you know, the emotion. So brings, like, all, um, aspects of beauty.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Into the, um, you know, workshop. So.
Speaker B: Wow.
Speaker A: That's.
Speaker B: That's so amazing. What did. What did beauty mean to you back then when you were growing up, and what does it mean to you now?
Speaker A: Um, so again, like you said, like, about wealth.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So, um, I think beauty and wealth now is very connected. So when I was back there, I was young, so it was just like, um, the look, you know, like, how do I look? But you never think about what it does to your body. So. So the way I look at beauty here is because now I have a knowledge beside, like, the way you look. It should also be, um, the way and what it does to your body. Uh, um. But when I grew up, I was young and I was like, oh, you know, I just want to look good. But now I'm like, I want to look good and I want to stay healthy. I want to know what goes on my skin. So that's the difference between. But at, um, the same time, um, my grandma aged naturally. She didn't care much how many wrinkles I have. She was aging beautifully, and she didn't want to just transform her face to someone else.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But now here I see people try to just completely change their appearance. Yeah. So which I don't like. I want to try to tell them, you know, these are skincares. It's gonna take care of you, but it's not gonna transfer. Transform your, you know, face to someone else.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So it's also, mentally, you have to be like, educate yourself what you want.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Like, you see some people, they are at the beauty salon like, every day.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Some people, like, I'm saying, like, my grandma aged beautifully, like, uh, wrinkles, like, old, but she was happy and fine. Yeah. So that's also another thing I see here. The beauty back home and the beauty here is like a little bit different. Or maybe the time. I would say maybe if I go back home now, it's going to be the same. But m. People try to be someone else.
Speaker B: Absolutely.
Speaker A: Yeah. Which is not correct.
Speaker B: I definitely want to double click on that because a while back I was reading this article. Um, that was. It talked about how the cosmetic industry, and I'm talking about cosmetic in terms of people kind of transforming themselves. The industry was booming. You know, like the. The average, you know, person that does these, like, facial surgeries and all this kind of stuff. A lot of them, but a lot of people were also dying from it. Right. Because it's very expensive. So people don't go to the right places. And I think this article was mainly talking about Korea and Asia. So they were doing things to kind of like, start to regulate the industry and so on. There's so many instances of people who have tried to transform themselves into someone else, and. And then they end up, you know, either not happy with the process later down the line. Now they want to transform back to who they used to be, and then that causes so many complications for young people that are listening to this right now. I think there are people that deal with kind of insecurities about who they are and how they look and so on, and so they then want to be. Look like a Kardashian. I actually read a headline the other day that said more Americans want to be less like Kardashians now. But you can see how that's transformed because, like, in a couple of years, years back, most people wanted to be a Kardashian. Right. Have the Kardashian look and all of that. But now people are transforming and shifting away from that. If there's a young person that's listening to us right now who's probably feeling insecure about how they look and so on, maybe they've looked at an influencer and now they're inspired. They want to go get some cosmetic changes to their lips, to whatever they want to do to themselves. What are you going to tell them?
Speaker A: Um, so it's really tricky, like, when you're very young and insecurity exists. So you have to, like, as a parent or anyone who are around these people, like, they need to grow up a little bit before make any big decision. I think, like, um, not too young, but, um, big brands, they need to start advertising or the models, they are bringing very diverse, different look. You know, um, they don't have to be always like, one specific look. So then people try to match with all the social media. Yeah. People want to try to be, you know, like someone.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And, um. But I think it's a matter of the whole collaboration of brands. People like young audience, school, like, everyone to break this, um, as, like, this is a great look, you have to have this size of, you know, I. This size of lip. No, that, like, you. You were born like that.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: That's the best look you can get.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And then if you change anything, maybe in the picture you might look good. But believe me, in person, something's off. So in a picture, I agree, if you do so many things, you're gonna look great because, um. But symmetry matters. If something is off, your brain's gonna say, oh, this. This person doesn't look, like, perfect, but, uh, she looks great. But to your brain, the symmetry is off. But, um, for. I think, um, first, social media is like, I can't compete with that. Like, if my daughter grows and then she want to watch something. But as a parent, I would control at some age that I know they are very insecure. I have to control. Yeah. But once they grow up, maybe they better, you know, understand what they're doing. Um, but it's very, um. The decision is really private. Yeah. So I can't comment on that.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So we have to figure out where the insecurity comes from. Maybe goes to mental health.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And then from there. But, um. M. It's a really good question. I like that. I mean, I never thought about it, but now I'm thinking, what makes people to go to this direction? That's the. I don't know.
Speaker B: It's very tough.
Speaker A: It's very tough question. But, uh, at least I know when they are very young, parents should take care of them. They don't let them to be exposed to something that they should not be exposed to. Yeah.
Speaker B: But I think that exposure is important. And I was just having this conversation with my wife the other day, and I said, God is a perfect artist. There's a specific reason he gave you that kind of eyes that you have. He's, you know, like, when you look at the creation of the world and the things like, I mean, you look at some of these fishes and there's, you know, a fish might have maybe six fins. There's no fin on that fish. That's just extra. That's just there. It has a purpose. Nothing is just happening for just to happen, you know? And I kind of like transformed the same thought to that whole process of, you know, why do people want to transform who they are, you know, from this perfect creation that they have? And to your point, maybe we might never know the answer to that. Maybe there's multiple facets to that. To that whole. To that whole thing. Um, yeah. And so many things go into play, whether it's like bullying, social media, you know, like what people say about them, who they're inspired by, what they see, what they consume and so on. So, uh, it's a very delicate topic, for sure.
Speaker A: But at least for my kids, I know, like, I keep them busy with sports. So don't watch social media. That's so good. Get busy, like, playing, like. Yeah, so you're only social media, but eventually, I don't know, with AI and I can't even imagine, like, in 10 years maybe what's gonna happen.
Speaker B: But yeah, yeah, no, it's so interesting. Um, okay, so one of the things that I learned about getting ready for this episode, I was just looking at all these cosmetic products that are out there. It's a lot of them, by the way. And I think I was telling you the story of I went to Sephora with my wife the other day and I wasn't there to buy, so I was able to actually look around and, you know, I was just like, people watching and just observing and I'm like. And she went there for one thing and she must have looked at at least like 15 different things while, while she was there. And I'm like, wow, that's a lot. Like it could be really overwhelming. But while I was researching I saw the top five cosmetic product out there. Number one is a lipstick, mascara, dip brow pomade. I don't even know what that is. Um, powder and then the lip pencil. How does Stir Lab help people create some of these products right now?
Speaker A: So we have um, we don't have mess because my whole um, lab setup is based on preservative free.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So Anhydris formulation and um, I'm working with a colleague at Stanford to also design a container that can self preserve the water based formulation. So that's a deep tech. It takes longer. But m. Because my whole concept is preservative free, I go anhydrate. So whatever you said on the list. So mascara, I'm not doing it because I have to use preservative and it's just um, against my vision for now until I figure out how to do
Speaker B: it to match your vision.
Speaker A: And, and um. But yeah, I, we can do the um, lip pencil, um, lipstick and yeah. So we can make um, um, lip gloss and uh, blush. So we have all sort of um, like products. So. And it's again so you go to Sephora, you see that craziness because people like to experience before they buy.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So but they've experienced the finished product.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: They're not experiencing the process. The process which I'm adding in. So it's going to be. If they're spending one hour at Sephora, they can spend one hour and 30 minutes my lab to make it.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So that's a good point. Yeah. So um, it's, it's a whole experience. That's why Sephora is um, very different and from other stores because you go test out. Oh, I don't like the feel, I like the color. Um, but. Yeah, that's the but. Yeah. We are making so many things. It is just a water based product.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: I don't introduce that yet until we figure out how we can, you know, solve the container problem.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But anything else, we have it and every single thing that goes into product, I studied and like I'm using mica. Where the mica comes from is it colored mica? Because some people advertise, oh, I have mica, um, pigment in my lipstick, you know. But um, if it's colored, it has dye.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: You can miss you Know spell that I say, oh, I have mica. I'm safe. But like, oh, is it. Does it have color? Oh, it's hot color. Okay. So it has dye in it. So, um, it's just so many things that I studied before I bring it into my lab. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker B: So let me ask you. This is. So once water is introduced into the process, then there has to be preservation. Is that what it is? Oh, interesting. Okay, interesting. So the more moisture, the.
Speaker A: The product is they live on water. Yeah. The bacteria, the fungi. So all of those, they need water to survive.
Speaker B: Right.
Speaker A: And, um, so. And the lotion you buy.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Is basically 80% water. And you have oil and you have emulsifying wax to basically mix the oil and water together. And then you add the rest of the thing for aesthetic look of the lotion. So the right viscosity, the right feel, the right color, the light smell, you know, um, so these are like. I call it feeling.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So you add that so you can sell.
Speaker B: Interesting.
Speaker A: So, um, but actually the whole lotion, the active part is the oil, and maybe the active ingredient, that does the job of wrinkle and everything. But the rest might be something for the product who goes on the shelf, you know?
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Um, so the lotion, it doesn't lose the viscosity, it doesn't collapse. So we add something to make it, like, more fluffy. So there are so many, um, things to it, but it's just the oil and, uh, water. And then you have water, you add preservative.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So there's no way you can go around it.
Speaker B: Right.
Speaker A: People does that, but it's not a right way. You do more harm to people if you say, I am preservative free.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Uh, product. But you have water.
Speaker B: Interesting. So I'm thinking of lotion right now. It's. It's kind of funny, but I've probably used a ton of different lotions in my life. I've used cocoa butter, you know, I've used cerave, you know, you just name it. What is the one thing that shouldn't be in my lotion? Like when I get out the shower, when I pick up my lotion. What's that one thing that if I see on that ingredient list, this thing has to go in the trash?
Speaker A: Um, I think the aldehyde releasing ingredient. Um, I think now FDA started banning all those. Um, so those are the one that started to get banned. Um, I think that's something. Um, there can be so many ingredients that they can release aldehyde. So I can't name all of it, but it's something that if you see 20 years ago, 10 years ago, it was okay, but again now they say, oh, you know, let's just get, get this out of our formulation or retinol is very popular, but, um, they start to add like the higher percentage into the lotion. But now European, um, organization, they started to say, oh, you know, it's vitamin A and it's. If you use it three times a day, you get more than what you need, vitamin A in your body. So, um, you should not go more than 0.3% of the retinol in your daily routine. So now they're taking all these products out of the shelf which are above that percentage. But they start in Europe once it takes time to get here. But of course, like, that's another example. Like, retinol is big, but now it's a, um, like discussion about the percentage. Shouldn't M be too high? It's not good for the body. So, yeah, it's going to damage. It's going to increase the vitamin A in the body. It's going to damage the liver, the bone density and all of that. So, so that's one thing. But for your lotion, I would say aldehyde releasing ingredient is something that, if I see I would throw it out. So, um, like, it's, it's banned. It's not. Um, yeah. And people talking about the like, um, hormone disruptor chemistry. Um, like all the chemicals that mimic the structure of your hormones and your body kind of messed up. Oh, is this from outside or is it the body doing it? So those one are also on the list. They keep adding like, hey, some synthetic fragrance. They have that. So if you see fragrance synthetic, you have to make sure what is in it. So, um, they have a lot of like, um, hormonal disruptor.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Chemical in it. So it's really wide and broad. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B: I mean this is, this is so fascinating to me. That's why I keep telling you you're doing really, really important work. And it's, I'm so inspired by what you're doing. Um, it's so needed. Right. Because, you know, for someone like me, uh, I should probably look at the ingredients much closer. But now that I'm listening to you and kind of getting enlightened, I'm like, yeah, uh, I, uh, need to do a better job. And I can imagine there's so many men and people like me out there that are like, you know, I don't really look at these ingredients so thank you so much for everything that you're doing.
Speaker A: Thank you.
Speaker B: It's really awesome. Okay, so the next thing I want to talk about is kind of like skincare routine.
Speaker A: Mhm.
Speaker B: Because if you look on social media, I think that's one of the thriving type of content out there, people showing their skincare routines. But most of the time these people, some might be influencers and they're just trying to sell a product. And there are other people that are genuinely showing you what their skincare routine is. What should our skincare routines look like? If you don't mind? Start with men. Because I think most men don't have a skincare routine. And I actually started thinking about this yesterday. Yesterday when I was preparing for our episode. I was like, what is my skincare routine? And I'm like, I don't think I really have one. So I started to learn about all these like products that should go in your skincare routine. Like, you know, number one, you need the cleanser and then the serum and blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, is this even good? I'm like, oh no, I know who I'm going to ask if the routine is good to have a cleanser and you know, retinol and all this kind of stuff in there. So tell us about skincare routines and what should go into it.
Speaker A: Yeah, so, so for me, like one of the misleading advertised marketing is like, you know, you wake up in the morning and you wash your face with soap. I'm like, oh, your body tries so hard to make all this oil overnight, beautiful oil, and you strip it out in the morning with soap and put something else on top of it. So um, and this is different from region by region. Like I'm from the country, like I'm like brown skin. Some people are like white, you know, so they have different, um, they can have different routine based on their needs. But for me, one of the routine, and I'm so against it is like you wake up and you use harsh soap and get rid of all the oil that naturally your body produce and then put another oil that comes from plant. So um, this doesn't make sense for me, like, but someone say, oh no, you, you know, I have to wash my face with the soap and like I have to do my morning routine and then I have to do my night routine. So for me I don't have a morning. Like, I'm like, my body does the best job overnight. And um, I think one item, that's it. It's just getting crazy about like Oh, I have to do this. It's just you play to feel better, but it doesn't do anything magically. I'm saying skincare is not transforming. Anyone is just taking care of you. You feel good. If you want to be someone else, it's a surgery. It's like other things you can do to change yourself. But if it's a skin routine, just find something that you like and then, um, it can nourish your skin. And it comes from natural ingredients. So later on you should not, you know, throw it in the trash because, oh, you know, two years ago they said, this is good, but not now. Um, but the routine that I would say is like moisturizing people who care about the wrinkle, um, they can have that, like at night, but having vitamin C and then, um, have your skin photosensitive and then go out in the sun and then come back home. So it's really like, you have to know what goes on your skin. So there are some ingredients that you have to do it at night. No sun exposure. So you have to follow that. But except that one item and that I would say based on who you are, if you have a very dry white skin, maybe you have to do it two times. But like me, like, I have more like oily skin. Just one is enough for me just to take care of my skin. That's it. But, um, some people have five different things to try on, but it's just to make them feel good. But it's not actually doing anything different than a person who does one. You know, doing more doesn't mean it does more. So that's what I'm saying.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But, um, just, um, listen to your body and see where you come from. Like, you don't have to use the product, uh, from different that isn't tested for different skin. For your skin, you are yourself, you have to figure out. That's why it's really important to customize. Like, oh, you know, this is too oily, this is too dry. I don't want oil, I want water, you know, so, um, but the routine that you said is, um, I'm a very natural way of doing things. And I think one thing can do a lot. Um, if you buy a right product, has right thing, you need one. But if you want to play around and you're feeling good, you can buy four or five. It's just up to you. You have to just educate yourself that your body is, is your friend, is the best person that tells you what it needs.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So don't Try to copy what other people are doing. M. So, um, I think that's really hard. But. But you can figure that out?
Speaker B: Yeah, no, definitely.
Speaker A: I talk too much about this.
Speaker B: No, no, no. I think you're sharing some very helpful insights. Because like even one of the things that I started asking myself is this whole thing with the cleanser before people go to sleep. Right. Because now you're saying your body's producing all this like natural oil.
Speaker A: Yeah.
Speaker B: So now I'm starting to think if you put a cleanser on, does that stop the body from doing what it was going to do when you go to sleep? Or do you just, you know, just wash your face with just water and nothing else and then go to sleep? Like, you know, like what's the right approach?
Speaker A: So I think is, um, what kind of soap they are cleanser. But again they have different percentage of surfactant to strip away the oil. Some are really harsh, some are not. So if you find the right one that is cleaning your face, but it's not like just washing away whatever is on your face, that's good. But there are some people who are very sensitive. They have to basically completely clean their skin.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Otherwise they go red in the morning, break out or so it's. That's why I'm saying listen to your skin and go after what your skin tells you.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So don't, don't say because my friend is doing it, I have to do it.
Speaker B: Right.
Speaker A: But that cleanser, again, there are so many different types, different power. So. And from there you can figure out, oh, this is a good one because I don't feel too dry and it's not too much surfactant in it, so I can use it or emulsifying wax. So. But that's what I say. Yeah. So it's. I liked, I like bodies oil. So I'm not a big fan of like cleaning. Cleaning and like putting something else. So. But the active ingredients. Yes. So if I have like I have to deal with my pigmentation. Yes. So I'm gonna add like a lotion that specifically does that job. Yeah. But not doing it because someone else is doing it.
Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome.
Speaker A: Did I answer your question?
Speaker B: No. You did. You did. Yeah. You did. I think it's uh, it's a matter of patience.
Speaker A: Mhm.
Speaker B: Trying things, figuring out what works for you. And like you said, there's a lot of products out there. Like you see someone's makeup bag and it's like, it's like a suitcase and I'm like Oh, my God, do you need all this stuff? You know, and. And so there's so much to take from. From what you share. So thank you so much. Um, so I definitely want to shift into business more. Kind of like business trends, especially with, um, with the natural, um, natural cosmetics. I think I was telling you before we started recording, I was looking at some numbers, and some of the numbers are outstanding, outstanding. Especially I think Starting from the 2000s, there's a shift towards wellness, right? People are kind of wellness conscious. More people want to live more healthier lives and so on. And I think, you know, that. That headline that I mentioned, less Americans want to. Want to become like, uh, want to be kind of like Kardashians. I think that probably relates to that more, where people are becoming more conscious and saying, you know what, natural is good. You know, embracing it more. And I think the numbers back it up because natural cosmetics, you know, 2025 is projected to derive 55 billion 2025, but by 2034, it's supposed to be 122 billion. That's a huge jump for natural cosmetics. And so I think of Stellabs and what you're doing, and, you know, when we started, you're like, you know, I just got started, and it's, you know, it's heading in the right direction. Numbers don't lie, right? The numbers are giving you the signal. So when you hear numbers like these, like, what. What does. What do you think about that?
Speaker A: I mean, that's. Yeah, I know it's a huge number. And, you know, there are big players who basically try to take the big
Speaker B: part of the pie.
Speaker A: I know now the AI come in and then they have all. We formulated something with AI is cheaper. This is a new molecule. So there are so many things, um, with like a bigger player. And, um, I mean, I. I didn't start it because I thought it's going to. I mean, I see the news, but I started it because I wanted to educate people. But, um, yeah, when I read all the news, I'm like, oh, yeah, it's big, but, you know, it's also very crowded. Like, market. Like everyone nowadays, they can say, oh, I made something, and then I want to sell it on Etsy or like, um, you know, things. They have to be also tested. Ingredient, you're buying, where you're buying from. These are all important too.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Um, so, um, it's. I mean, it's a huge market. Uh, there are big players. AI comes in. There are so many things coming with the AI in beauty. You Go check your skin. And they say, oh, based on your skin, you have to buy this product. These are all coming out. And um, investors, they have invested billion dollars in the AI in beauty for customization. Um, but, um, yeah, I think for Stairball Lab, I, I, um, hope that the way we call natural. So what you see, they say natural product, but what does it mean, natural product? Does it means you have, um, this product that has 1% of almond oil? Or is it, what is that definition? So I, um, think from that definition maybe 5% can be real natural product and the rest would be other things. But the way we market it is just natural. Um, I think the meaning of the natural is really, it has to have a definition. And based on that we say, oh yeah, it's a $2 billion market for natural.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But I would say maybe that's for beauty product. Let's just not call it natural. Because you can say anything natural.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Even if you go to the market, you buy food, they say natural. Oh my God. What does it mean? And you read and like, okay, um, yeah, an apple is natural.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And then everything processed after that goes into chemical process. Yes. So it's processed. Yeah, but, yeah, so it's a big market. But, um, I hope I'm going in the right direction. But my definition from natural might be different from what is out there.
Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A: I don't know. No, it's a, it's a. Maybe in like 10 years I'm back here. Hey, papa. Yeah, I'm here. Like I'm a big player.
Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Oh yeah. I could, I could definitely see it though, because, you know, I think, uh, people are becoming more, more and more conscious. And so even another thing that I learned is people, there's a need for DNA based products, which is really, really interesting. So like, people really want to like personalize the products that they use. And it goes back to a lot of what you said. Right. Which is, you know, the skincare routine that works for you might not work for me. Right. Because our DNA might be different. And then there might be one thing that you do that glows your skin. And then I do it and I probably break out. Right. And so it's, it's so interesting. And you help people get to that, actually do that personalization where, you know, I think where the gap too is people are not really involved in the process of making these things. Unless like you're in a focus group and so on. But even most of the time you're in a focus group, you're probably helping with the marketing of the product less so than the formulation and what goes into the product. Whereas when they come to Stir Lab, they're actually able to feel the product and so on. You know, I can imagine. I've never been to Stella, but I hope I get the chance to come there soon, to come and, you know, make some product. But I can imagine making my own product and getting sort of like an epiphany of, oh, my God, this is how these guys are making this stuff. And so then you start to be really conscious about every other thing. So, like, I. Very recently, I remember I was doing this fast, which is called a Daniel Fast. And you don't eat anything except fruits and veggies and grains, really, like real food. And so we were. We were in Tahoe and me and my wife were like, okay, we're gonna go find some food. And so we walk into this Chinese restaurant and we were able to order Edamames because it's, you know, it's. You know, it's not. There's nothing else included in it. And then we're looking at the menu and we're like, we could eat grains. So, like, just like, brown rice is fine. So we go to the guy and we're like, they had this rice. And we're like, what do you. What do you guys cook this with? And the guy's like, I don't know. And I'm like, what do you mean you don't know? Like, you work here. And then he shows us the bag of rice next to me, M. And he's like, that's the bag. You can read it. And I'm looking, I'm like, how does this guy not know what goes into the food that he's selling M out here? And that made me think. And I'm like, wow. So you. You go out there, you buy this food, you just. There's no idea of what really goes into it. And the same thing can be applied with the products that we use, like the cosmetics especially. You know, we go out there, we buy it, we bring it home, and then we use it. Five years later, the FDA is like, oh, this is banned. Well, you've used it for so long now. What's the long term effect? No one knows that you have to wait to see what's going to happen again. That's why I think the work you're doing is so important.
Speaker A: Right.
Speaker B: And so I hope these numbers that we're talking about reflect, um, in your business also. Right? So. So that you're Able to see it and, and people that are listening also. I hope you're, you're being enlightened to kind of start to think about natural and chemical in, in a different way. Like think about the products that you use, how you add new products to your routine. Are you just looking at what that influencer posted? Are you kind of taking it, uh, a step further, right. To kind of see what are the preservatives that were used in this product and so on. Um, so thank you so much for sharing that.
Speaker A: No problem. Yeah, so it was just great discussion. I like people to get educated, then they can make a better decision, uh, rather than just following things. And um, remember, um, yes, social media is out there, but don't just people, um, judge people based on their look on the camera or like you have to see a person in person.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And say, oh, what are you using? It looks good. But influencer, they can like use filter, whatever. They look different. And you're, oh, I want to be like her. So just be careful of like what you're, you know, watching and. But yeah, I'm, I'm um, I'm glad that I came here. Like, um, and I hope, um, the audience, some of them, they now know about like natural chemical, like what does it do to their body and um, make a better decision.
Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, well, definitely that. I hope so too because it's, it's really important. I think one thing we haven't talked about too much is waste also because a lot of this stuff, there's also the waste aspect of it. Is that a focus for you as, uh, the lab, uh, in terms of like trying to stir towards like zero waste and minimizing your impact on the environment.
Speaker A: That's one of my, um, I would say tagline is like, I'm like waste free lab. Because everything we make in the lab, they take home. Like any waste, they can reuse it, we mix it with the oil. They can use scrub or they can, if we distill something to extract the scent, they separate oil and water and they can take um, the water home, use as a toner. So nothing goes into the trash. So, um, yes, I definitely no, um, no waste. Take everything home and they are happy. Then they take everything home with them and it's based on their needs. So we use the amount that they really need for that batch.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So nothing big. So made just for them. Buy them.
Speaker B: Yeah. Awesome. I really love that. That's interesting. You take everything home with you. You're not, you're not leaving anyways no.
Speaker A: Take everything off.
Speaker B: Yeah. That's so awesome. I love that. Um, okay, so another thing I want to talk about is the, your entrepreneurial journey with stellab. So you know, in the beginning you talked about how you, you worked in the corporate, you learned and then you kind of, you know, um, transition into stellab. Can you talk about your entrepreneurial journey? Are there things that you've learned that has inspired you or are there things that you've done so far that if you could go back, you probably do differently?
Speaker A: Um, so things that I would do differently. Maybe I would start it earlier.
Speaker B: Wow.
Speaker A: Because you know, I had this idea a little bit in my mind, but if I tell this idea to you, it, it looks really like strange. Um, you know, I want to make a lab that people can make their own product.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And people said what?
Speaker B: Mhm.
Speaker A: That was like, I had this idea like earlier on, but people were like, what is that? And it was the time that natural nothing existed yet nobody cared. Like, I go buy thing. You know, I don't want to spend time making it.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And then, um, but after 10 years, and then I'm like, oh, now I have a daughter, she's asking for it. I have this idea. Maybe it's the time. And so I had this idea just on the paper. Yes.
Speaker B: Yes.
Speaker A: And so solo founder with the idea sitting on my table and I'm like, oh, I have to make this happen in the lab. So I have to buy everything.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Set it up, make it happen in two hours. People don't want to stay in my lab for six hours to extract things. So I spent four months doing it. But what I would do, would do it was like I would do it earlier. Uh, I mean, I learned a lot working in corporate. I was always R and D, research scientist in the lab, doing things. I was also teaching at university at some point.
Speaker B: Wow.
Speaker A: Uh, chemistry. So I put, you know, all my knowledge, all my experience together to make this a little lab or little chemistry class for people. So. But yeah. And um, the thing is you always start with something.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And you never know what's going to happen after that. So you start to like, like maybe 15 years ago, I wouldn't think that I would be here.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So, um, it doesn't mean everyone has to start right at the thing that they really want to do and they're going to be 100% successful. So it's going to be a road that you follow and then you end up eventually at the spot that you really happy staying at. So.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Yeah. So that's what I think. Yeah.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So it's like, um, it's really interesting because it's not just my knowledge of being scientists, it's just so many things around it that I'm learning.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So I'm now trying to be everything, like putting all the hats. Yeah. So it's very interesting to see myself just not be a simple scientist. I can talk to customers, I can educate them. I can do marketing, I can do, you know, business, all of that, which is fun.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: It's not easy, but I enjoy doing it.
Speaker B: Absolutely.
Speaker A: It's a good, uncomfortable position.
Speaker B: Wow. Yeah, you, you dropped a lot of knowledge days. You saw me say wow. Because I've talked to so many entrepreneurs that they would say, I wish I started earlier. And it's, it's so interesting. But to your point also, it's, it doesn't mean you should start right away also. Right. But it's, it's so interesting when I talk to them because, you know, you talk to them like, you know, once you start seeing success, you're like, you start to think from the point before you started, when you are doubting yourself, when you didn't think this is a viable idea, when you're telling people and they're looking at you upside down, like, what are you even, what are you talking about? You know, the fear of jumping into something and not knowing what it, what it's going to become and so on. And then you finally start, and then you see the impact that you're making for people, and then you start to wonder, what if I had started earlier? You know, and that, that's not supposed to be discouraging. That's supposed to actually even motivate you more. Right. Because if you should have started earlier and now you've started, then just keep doing what you're doing. Right. And then even scale it up even faster, even more, get more people involved and so on. So thank you so much for sharing that. That's, ah, a, that's a really good one. I'm really enjoying this conversation. Um, so if someone is listening to you, one of the things that you mentioned also is you're kind of like wearing many hats. Right. So there's, there's a guy in the corner right now that's listening to the podcast that's saying, you know, yeah, you know, I hear you. Like, I, I, I really want to do this thing, but I'm only good at this one thing, and I'm not sure if, you know, if I start it, what am I going to do about the business part, what am I going to do about the marketing part and so on. Do you have any advice for them how you've been able to kind of like navigate wearing multiple hats and being in that uncomfortable but comfortable situation?
Speaker A: Um, I think, um, meeting right people at the right time, it was really helping me. Like, um, I was a great scientist. I. So my. I think I'm good into like, um, designing new thing, new product and all formulating. But, um, I was lucky. Maybe lucky is not a good word because I put myself out to be visible. Yes. To meet new people. Each people that I meet, they give me an advice. They have different expertise. They guide me through something that maybe take longer for me to understand.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: But, um, even if you are good at one thing.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: And you believe in yourself and you have a vision, just follow that. Everything comes true. And then you have to put yourself out and meet people and listen to them. So, um, like the way you're saying you meet interesting people on your way, you know, they have, they say, hey, use this one, or, oh, I know this app. Or I, you know, I know someone can help you. A student, an intern, you know. So, um, it's basically, you need help, definitely, but you have to figure out how to do it. Like, I needed a lawyer I couldn't afford, but a guy was telling me, you know, there are like students working with professors at university here in San Jose. You apply and you get free feedbacks. So these are the things that happens when you meet people. So if you sit alone at home, that's not going to happen. So you have to go out, find people, like, uh, and then, um, for the part that you don't have a knowledge, gain that through the reading books or, I don't know, like the, uh, digital, um, you know, books or people. I found it. People are the fastest way. Instead of me figuring out how to do it, if I meet the right person, it's one sentence and it's just right.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So, uh, even if you are good with one thing, it doesn't matter. You have a vision, you follow that and never give up. It's just going to come together and. And you look back and I'm like, oh, my God. I. Like, I went all the way to this point, so I never thought about it. So. Yeah. So don't give up. It's just. And don't stay home alone. Like, you know, just say, hey, I have to be lucky. That person is lucky. I'm not. Because. Yeah, you're not out There.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Nobody knows you exist. Yeah. So that's what I would say.
Speaker B: Amazing advice right there. Wow, that's. That's so powerful. Um, thank you so much for sharing that. And, um, you know, in the world of entrepreneurship, I get to speak to some women also in that world. Not as much as I would like. And so when I get the opportunity to speak to people like you, I'm always really, really excited. Um, because I think there's a lot of women out there that have huge potential and things that they want to do that are either afraid, they're not sure, and so on along your way. Is there any advice that you've gotten that's been really, really helpful that someone needs to hear right now?
Speaker A: Um, for me is like, you have one life to live. Yes. And if you have an idea that it's coming through your brain now like every other month, like, oh, I have to do this and it goes away. I have to do this, it goes away. So it means you have to do it like so pick that and then just focus on it. No matter your woman or like a, uh, 17 year old kid that has a, you know, company, they have an idea. Yes. So age, sex, it doesn't matter. It's just. But if you have an idea. And um, like me, I had this idea 10 years ago, but it was just an idea and it went away because people were like, oh no, what is that? Yeah, but it came back again. It went off, came back and I'm like, okay, I'm gonna pick it up.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Because it's something like why it comes into my brain, you know. And uh, for all these women, like, I think women need more support, um, um, than men as like a group of women, like more power, more like girl shot, you know. So for me, finding those founder like me, women founder with the same, you know, kind of like we go out, have a dinner together, but we discuss the way we like we, you know, we have fun. Um, so, um, I think that's important too to find, find women group.
Speaker B: Yeah. Uh, community to community.
Speaker A: That push you a little bit further, uh, up. So it's like, oh, yeah, I know you can do it. Maybe men, they wouldn't say that, but it's like, yeah, you can do it maybe like in like a short term, but for remains like, oh, you know, it's like full paragraph. You can do it. You do that. You're you, you are powerful. You're. So then they become like, oh, I can do it.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: So, so they need that. So I think community exactly what you say is really important for women entrepreneurs. So, um, that's what I got benefit from. So now I became like part of nabo, the national association of Women in Business. So yeah, so I'm on board of the Silicon Valley chapter because they gave so much and they helped me a lot. So I'm like, I'm giving back. I'm going to be back on the board, I'm going to help other entrepreneur. And what I got benefit the most was the community and the help from them, the support. So, uh, if they are hesitate, they just need that kind of like push from their community, I think.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Yes.
Speaker B: Yeah. No, I think that's really important, like being in the right environment. Especially when, when you have that crazy idea. Sometimes the difference is who you tell that idea to. Right. Because you're going to tell someone and they're going to be like, are you serious? Just find something else to do. Or you're going to tell someone else and they're just going to spark a, ah, fire in you. Right. Or they're going to tell you, oh, I know someone else you should talk to about this idea and then that gives you that validation and then the next step and so on. So who you meet in the community, so important. Yeah.
Speaker A: Like everything we talk about about entrepreneurship is like, community, people around you to help you solve some problem, meet. Right people. Yeah, I agree with that. But like women out there, don't hesitate. Just like, because you're women, it doesn't mean you have to step back. I know there are so many responsibilities. You're a mom, you know, you have to take care of kids. But find the right moment. Um, I mean, there is no right moment. I always say it's always like, do it. So if you wait for the very, very right moment, it never comes. So. So I would say once you feel a little bit comfortable that you can take over, start do what you want to do. Yeah, yeah. So. And you need a little bit of, um, I, um, would call it, um, girl shot. Like you go meet girls and you get like different power. Oh, yeah. Okay.
Speaker B: I love that.
Speaker A: Yeah.
Speaker B: Girl shot. Yes. Awesome. Awesome. Thank you so much for, for sharing that. Um, so maybe the last two things that I want to talk about and then we can definitely wrap because this has been a really, really good conversation. Um, let's talk about the future of stellab. Right? One of the things that I heard you say is you're on this board because they give you so much and you want to give back. You strike me as someone who gives back? Like when I think of starlab, you're really giving back in a way that is massive. Right? Like you're giving people back that autonomy to control the products that they use, which is huge. It's uh, a lot of ways that you get that today. Like you think about, you know, AI right now, right? It's, you don't have that much autonomy really. It's what is out there is what you get. You don't have that much autonomy unless you know there's people that are building their own product and so on and customizing. But, but you're helping people in, in such a massive way. What does the future of Stir Lab look like?
Speaker A: Um, so for me is, I told you, like, I'm like, I want to have different branches everywhere so people can come in, even like the places that is very remote. And like people say, oh, you can't make money here, but I don't care. I mean, I have my headquarters somewhere that I know, okay, I can make money here, but I also want everyone to have access to it. So, um, so my future would be these workshops in different location. And uh, one of the things that I'm really hopeful to get it done is the uh, self preserving container. So that's a big thing. But um, I mean it takes longer. But that's, that's going to be big if it happens. So uh, that's going to be the future. And then uh, I would have more chemists, um, in different, you know, locations. And then maybe I have few products, the best of the best online because I'm talking to customers. Yeah, I know what they want and I can have like the best of the best what they want to sell online. And um, but that's my vision is the whole lab is not selling online. But um, yeah, having the lab, the chemistry lab in different cities, um, like an ice cream shop, but in a beauty paradise.
Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. Yes, I could, I could see that it's, it's needed. I mean I, like I said, there's a huge market out there and I hope you get your, you know, your ideas and the initiatives that you're taking helps you to get a huge percentage of that pie because it's really possible and I, I believe you can do it. You, you're already doing it, so just, just stay the course. Right. Um, yeah. Awesome. Thank you for sharing that. So maybe someone is listening and they're hearing about Stairlab and they're wondering, you know, where can I find it? What is this Stir Lab they're talking about maybe tell them a little bit more about it.
Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. So right now we have one location in Mountain View, California. Um, so basically somewhere between San Jose and San Francisco where people come in, they schedule an appointment online, they come in for two hours, they make their own product and they leave. And then they come like in a group of five or just one person. And um, that's um, the only physical location. But now we are introducing the online sale. So, uh, they can, um, check, uh, us out at, um, Stairbar Lab, um, Instagram and stairbarlab.com um, to schedule or buy online. But it's mostly like a physical location that makes it very unique. But if someone just wants to buy a product. We only have one or two products online just now. But, uh, they can check it out. But I'm open. If they have any question, they can email info@, um, stairbarlab.com I would be happy to answer any questions.
Speaker B: Yeah. Wow, that's a, That's a good resource to have. Right? Someone that knows, um, has that much knowledge with, um, formulation and so on. So thank you so much. Um, and then the last question. I know you talked about your daughter a little bit, and so I wanted to ask you what are. What is some of the advice that you're giving to your daughter these days that maybe if you want to share with us also?
Speaker A: Um, so I let her do everything herself. So I don't, you know, try to. I want her to decide on everything, learn as a woman. Like, she doesn't need anyone to tell her what to do. She. She is the one that can grow independently and um, make a decision herself. She's just 7, but she's doing it really good. And I think that's gonna help in future. If she has an idea or she want to do something, it's not like hesitation because she already learned to do everything herself. So, um, like the way I left the country is like, I told my mom, bye, I'm going to school with my single entry visa, that I. She knew that I'm not coming back for four years. And I'm like, I'm so proud of her that she let me go.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Because it's hard on her, but it was just because of me to thrive. So I want to be my mom for her.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: To not. My emotion doesn't involve in like thriving her. So I try to step back and let her, you know, decide like what she want to do. I mean, not crazy thing, but yeah.
Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. Yeah, we understand. Yes, we understand. Yeah.
Speaker A: But yeah, so I Think my. Yeah. Role model is my mom. Yeah, I love that. I want to be here.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Yeah.
Speaker B: Awesome. I really love that. And I'm sure there. There's some young moms up and coming moms out there that will hear this, and hopefully it's. It's good advice for them. So thank you for sharing that. Um, the final thing that I wanted to ask you, if there's anything that maybe you wanted to talk about today that maybe I haven't brought up that we haven't talked about yet.
Speaker A: No, I think I just enjoy talking to you. Um, I love what you're doing. I know. You're, like, amazing. I came here, I'm like, oh, my God, this place is just so professional. So I want to go sit down.
Speaker B: Thank you. We appreciate that. We appreciate that.
Speaker A: Yeah. So what you're doing is amazing. I've seen your podcast. That's why I came.
Speaker B: Yes.
Speaker A: Not, um, I don't say yes to all, but, like, I came here, I'm like, oh, I know papa. I like him. So, no, I don't have any. Do I have to ask? I know we can stop, but, like, do I have to ask you anything? You want me to?
Speaker B: Yeah, if you want to. If you have questions for me. Why not? I mean, sure. Yeah. It could be a two way street. It doesn't have to be one way.
Speaker A: Okay. No, but maybe, like, because you talk about beauty and wealth and give me more, because I know you're doing things. Yeah. So I want to, like, hear about your side of you. Like, uh, beauty, wealth, health, all of that.
Speaker B: Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Yeah, no, that's. No, that's a. That's a good one. Well, we can start.
Speaker A: Want you to talk, too.
Speaker B: Yeah, sure, sure, sure. Well, we can start with beauty. I think in terms of beauty, there isn't much that I do. Um, and. And so preparing for this podcast, I actually ended up learning a lot. Like, number one, I. I was born in Ghana. Right. So. And I grew up in Ghana till I was, like, 17 before I moved here.
Speaker A: You have no accent. That is cool.
Speaker B: Yeah, we speak English in Ghana, so that's. I think that was helpful that the queen's. The queen's English in Ghana. I think that was helpful. But I still have an accent, for sure. Like, you. You'd hear it if you. If you listen much closer. Um, so I never used something like a sunscreen ever when I was in Ghana. No concept of it. Most people in Ghana probably don't even use that. Right. And so especially, even preparing for this episode I start to think about all of these things. I'm like, I've never. I mean, I use a cleanser when I shower, but, like, besides that, there's, like, there's not much else that I. That I use. And so you. You know, this was very enlightening for me. Um, so in terms of beauty, I think the most I do is, like, get a haircut, get a shape up, and then I know I'm good. Um, so there isn't much there with beauty. But health is definitely a big thing for me. Like, I. You know, my wife was joking. I hit the gym twice yesterday. I try to stay as healthy as possible. And I actually started working out when I was in high school. And I remember one of. One of my buddies I went to high school with, his name is Juan Patino, we would skip lunch and then just go to the gym so that we can actually have access to the gym. Um, because after school, the gym will be taken by the football team and stuff like that. And that's when I started, and I. I never stopped, really. And the way I looked at it also was if I build all of this, like, you know, habits and muscle and all of that, if I stop, I'm gonna lose it and I'm gonna have to start all over again. So I look at it that way, and I'm like, okay, I can't stop. And also, I think of how I feel after I work out, and it's like, I don't really need someone to tell me to go work out. Like, I know how I feel after I work out, and when I'm having a day, I know exactly where to go. I know the exact workout to do that's gonna make me feel good. So, like, the health part is that the most difficult part of health for me is what I eat. And I think growing up in Ghana helped a lot, because the foods that we eat out there, there's not. We don't. We barely eat burgers nowadays. Like, that's like a thing in Ghana now. But burgers is not in our diet, really. Like, my grandmother probably never ate a burger when she was alive, right? Like, we don't eat that. And so those kind of foods was never really in. You know, it wasn't around me growing up. So I don't even crave those kind of foods. But it's kind of like that calorie control, like, controlling how much you eat and so on. I think that's like, the biggest thing for me. Like, sometimes I eat. I can eat. Like, people who know me know I can eat. And so that's like the. The part where I think I can. I can definitely do better with. Um, and then the wealth part. For me, wealth is more than money, right? Wealth is health, wealth is wisdom, wealth is patience, wealth is love, wealth is family, wealth is peace. It's literally everything for me. And so when I meet anyone, I know I can talk to them about wealth from any perspective, because most people associate wealth with money, but, uh, to me, that's not what it is. I think wealth is really everything. So I talk to a lot of people on the podcast, and I always ask them, what is your definition of wealth? And it's so surprising because I've always joked, I'm going to make a compilation. And when I make that compilation, you're going to realize every single person's definition is different. And that's what kind of confirms what I'm saying. Like, wealth is. Is everything to. It's everything to what you want it to be, you know, so for me, the main thing is I want to have that freedom, and I want to be able to live anywhere in the world and do whatever I want at any time. That's what wealth really is for me, and that's what I'm striving towards. And so I try to be a good steward of the resources that I have. You know, I try to give back as much as possible in whatever way I can, whether it's giving back people information, whether it's creating something for people to use, creating a podcast, people can listen and share information. Creating a platform where entrepreneurs like you can come on and share what they're building to the world and. And so on. So, you know, when I started a podcast, I had no idea what this thing was going to become, really. I really mean that. I started this thing in my bedroom with my friend Jomar, and he's an audio engineer. And my very first episode ever was with him. And that wasn't even us recording. That was after he gave me a list of equipment to buy. We were like, oh, we're going to test this thing out. So we started recording that day. And I was like, bro, I think this can be the first episode. He's like, ah, yeah, you should put it out. And I put it out. And I was like, okay, well, if I put it out, then I have to continue putting this thing out. And we've continued since, right? So started my bedroom, and then now what it's becoming, it blows my mind, right? And I think the potential is there for It. To continue to grow and continue to give people value in terms of wealth. So, you know, I said a lot there, but, yeah, those are, those are, uh, those are the things.
Speaker A: Amazing.
Speaker B: Yeah, thank you.
Speaker A: What I wanted to hear. Yeah, yeah. Congratulations.
Speaker B: Thank you. You too. On all your success.
Speaker A: Yes.
Speaker B: Yeah. Well, this has been such a great episode. Thank you for that question, by the way. That, that, that allowed me to talk, uh, a little bit. That was awesome. Um, yeah. And so to close this out, like I said, I ask every single guest that comes to the podcast, what is your definition of wealth?
Speaker A: Oh, okay. You gave me, like, the answer.
Speaker B: Yeah. I give you a preview of that. Yeah.
Speaker A: This is really, like, I don't know, like, now you're saying, um, I think love is very important. Like, you can be healthy, you can have lots of money, but empty heart, like, no love. Like you can't love someone or you can't be loved. Maybe that's. That's important. Yes. You need money. Um, if you don't have money to eat right. To do what makes you happy. Um, so I think that's it. And I had another thing about wealth, like, with love the money and do what you like to do.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Is something, um, that I have a different feeling having my own thing, like, set up, like, it moves slower. I make less money than I was in Incorporate as a scientist.
Speaker B: Yes.
Speaker A: But it's going slowly, but I'm happy and I'm excited.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Every time I wake up, I'm excited. So I'm not like, oh, it's Monday or Happy Friday. I'm like, yeah, it makes sense for me that time, but right now it doesn't make sense. Happy Friday. No.
Speaker B: Yeah. Every day is Friday.
Speaker A: It's not like that I'm not working. I'm so excited about what I'm doing that I feel so good that, um, Happy Friday. Doesn't mean anything to me right now. Uh, but do what you like and have people that love you and you love them around you. That's important. And then have money so you can do whatever you want to do. And then including your health, that comes with your money. Yes. So you need money to get checkup, you need money to buy good food, you need money to get natural beauty products.
Speaker B: Right.
Speaker A: That's right. So I think, um, yeah. Um, so. And also health. Yes. So health is important. Um, but at the same time, I say if someone is born with no legs. Yes. So they're not hundred percent healthy. Yes. Um, but doesn't mean they're not wealthy. So I don't know what to. This is one of the thing I. Sometimes I say, oh, being healthy is really good. But then I look around. Some people, they were born or they happen to have something go wrong without them knowing it, but it doesn't mean that they have to not be wealthy. So they just have to accept and then, um. Adopt. Yes. So that's it, I think.
Speaker B: Yeah.
Speaker A: Yeah.
Speaker B: Fantastic. Right there. Oh, man, this has been such a great episode. Thank you so much for coming on. I really enjoyed this conversation. I feel like we can even keep this going longer, but I. We're over an hour at this point already. Yeah. I usually tell people, you know, people ask me, how long is the podcast going to take? And I tell them, you know, maybe an hour. And in the middle of the conversation, when I tell them we've been recording for an hour, most times they can't believe we've been recording for an hour. Um, but, yeah, we're an hour and 26 minutes in right now. So, uh, this has been a great conversation. Thank you so much for coming. I appreciate you taking the time out to come out to join us on the podcast. Thank you, thank you, thank you, and thank you for listening. This has been a great episode. Reach out to Miriam, Check out Sterlab. I think you're going to really love it. It's been a blast. Thank you.
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