Beyond Heritage: Building Egypt's Next Generation of Lifestyle Destinations

Speaker A: Welcome. In this episode of the FHS Egypt podcast we are joined by wonderful Meena Vetlani, Managing Director Meena at Sectorlight. Following her participation at FHS Saudi Arabia, we discuss how Egypt can build distinctive destinations, connect with local and international audiences and turn its culture, geography and lifestyle into, into long term value for hospitality and real estate developments. Welcome Nina.

Speaker B: Thank you Daria for having me. It's a pleasure to be here.

Speaker A: Wonderful wonder, having worked across major regional destinations, uh what makes Egypt particularly exciting from that place branding perspective today?

Speaker B: Okay, and uh, that's a good question. So we've been spending a lot of time um, in Egypt recently working on various projects. Um, and I would say that Egypt is one of those rare destinations that always has uh, you know, already has something very extraordinary. Um, and um, you know it's already globally recognized so most countries spend decades actually building that awareness. Whereas Egypt um, starts with that incredible advantage through the history, the culture and the geography in terms of location. Um, so what's exciting today is that that conversation is evolving. So EGYP is no longer only about you know, the ancient history and the leisure tourism. We're seeing that emergence of real world class mixed um, use destinations, luxury hospitality, lots of branded residences, um, and then lifestyle led um, developments um, that are really creating that differentiator and actually people want, want to visit for more than just you know the history and the, the leisure but more to invest and live. Um, and I think you know the opportunity now is to complement the heritage with the contemporary narrative and um, it has a potential really to become an all year round destination that competes internationally. Um so I think you know it's a very exciting time. Um, and you know that uh, sort of brand placing perspective, uh sorry, place place branding perspective um, is ah, you know it's, it's yet to sort of fully evolve but you know they already have so much going.

Speaker A: Yeah, well that's true and they've got all those different areas that they're developing. Just before we jumped uh, on, on, on live here, we talked about um, north coast, particularly Cairo, lots of developments there, um, Red Sea that's a little bit more well established and they all offer very different experiences. How do you think should each of those destination define its own identity to differentiate between each other as well?

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean I think the key is the destination itself. Right. So every successful destination needs to have a clear point of view rather than trying to sort of appeal to everyone. Um, so Cairo is about culture, um, creativity, um, you know, connectivity, business, urban energy. Like that's Kind of where New Cairo especially like you know having spent more time there, um, you know I really enjoy that urban energy that it has. And then the north coast I think that has the potential to become really a primary lifestyle destination with some of the projects that we see coming up. I mean Namos just launched um, you know last week there and you know it really is positioned as um, kind of you know that all year round it can be positioned as that all year round destination through the hospitality, the wellness, the entertainment and, and that connectivity as well. Um, when you know when the infrastructure is there. Um today they're obviously very reliant on domestic and GCC market. Uh but I think there is huge potential for moving that into international and all the projects that we're working on up on the north coast are ultimately going to be targeted to those international audiences. Um, the Red Sea um, obviously as you said that's quite an established destination already. Um and I think they should continue to position uh it should continue to position itself around like the nature, the marine experiences um and a little bit more on the luxury and the wellness side. Um so actually like those two destinations, the north coast and the Red Sea, they don't you know rather than competing with each other these destinations should actually complement one another and actually give visitors different reasons to experience different parts of Egypt throughout, throughout the year.

Speaker A: And m, if we zoom in and actually look at the needs and aspirations of the visitors of all those different destinations, um, how do they differ across all of those?

Speaker B: Yes, I think buyers are becoming increasingly um, like they're not purchasing um a property anymore. It's not about owning an apartment. It's about purchasing a lifestyle that they want to be a part of. Um, domestic buyers obviously will often prioritize like family and um, familiarity and long term investment. So a lot of the um, you know domestic um Egyptian buyers, you know it's very common. Most of them have a second home up on the north coast for example. Um, so that's very, very common um within Egypt. And I think um, you know the Egyptians would rather invest. It's part of their culture. They would rather invest in property than keep the money in the bank. Um and obviously the volatility of the pound, you know that also is a compounded effect. It contributes to that. Um, but then regional buyers are looking for accessibility. They're looking for like standards of hospitality and they're looking for um, you know, confidence uh, in investment. Um so for international buyers um, that want that authenticity, they're looking to buy, to invest in trusted Brands and um, clearly kind of you know having that confidence to invest in that environment. So this is where branded residences become increasingly valuable because they reduce the perceived risk, um, and then elevate the overall customer experience.

Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. Well, uh, you know talking about regional um, local audiences as well, um, we've got now international audience looking uh, into the market quite heavily as well. How do you think and how can Egyptian developments appeal to all this unique different uh, group groups or set of groups without diluting its proposition?

Speaker B: Well I think um, speaking of sort of you know, brand strategy and proposition, one of the biggest sort of misconceptions is that you need to have a different proposition for every audience. Um and often we get developers coming to us saying okay, what's going to be proposition for this audience? And we don't. I mean what we need, what we always educate, um, you know our clients on is that we need one authentic proposition and different ways of telling that story to the different audiences. Um, so local buyers may connect through community. Um, you know that a lot of them will have friends that are also you know investing in those destinations. Um, and, and they'll go there with their families. GCC buyers as I said will be more um, on the accessibility, second home ownership side. So somewhere to get away, um, um, you know, kind of relax and unwind. Um, and I think again like speaking of like the north coast, I think there's you know that's actually a really prime location in terms of the climate and everything else. And then international investors, they will want um, you know, long term value and they will want um kind of to feel um, that they you know they have the confidence to invest through um, what you know through globally recognized hospitality brands. Um so yeah so you know in core like authenticity is the key and maintaining that core identity of the destination and then telling the story in different ways to different audiences, um, you know is our recommendation on you know, how to um, without how to not dilute the proposition.

Speaker A: Yeah, so my next question I guess sort of uh feeds into this discussion as well from uh, large mixed use development perspective. Uh, uh, how do you then create this one clear identity uh while you know giving each of the um, components like hotel or residences or retail component, uh its own role.

Speaker B: Yeah, so I guess kind of on off the back of what I was just saying, we always encourage clients to think destination first rather than development first. Um and I think the destination should have like one overarching promise, one personality, like one emotional story as a destination and then any hotels, residences, retail, um, entertainment, anything that falls under, that becomes different expressions of that story. Um, so you know, too often projects are marketed individually. Um, and we're seeing that with a lot of developments in the Middle east that we're working on where the overall sort of place making strategy hasn't come into play. And um, you know, each developer is working in different um, silos and you know, those developments have not been as um, successful. Um, so when everything works together and there's a strong placemaking strategy, you create a stronger recognition, um, and then ultimately a greater sort of long term value because buyers are investing in the destination, not just simply purchasing an apartment.

Speaker A: Yeah, no, absolutely. Well you mentioned Middle east and some of the developments here. We're both based in Dubai. So what do you think Egypt can learn uh, from that sort of scale and ambition of the Middle Eastern developments? Uh, but what they should really approach differently as well?

Speaker B: Yeah, I think there's a lot of learning. So the Middle east has obviously demonstrated what is possible in terms of long term vision and infrastructure and how that comes together with branding and how that is successful. Um, but one important lesson I think, um, is creating destinations rather than developments, which I keep saying. Um, and another is the value of that um, internationally recognized brand, um, in building that investor confidence and supporting that premium pricing that branded residences would, um, you know, would deliver. And um, Egypt in my opinion should not try to replicate what the GCC has done. You know, the competitive advantage for Egypt really is like the authenticity. So um, you know where I think Egypt has the greatest opportunity is to position itself as a contemporary lifestyle destination, um, that you know, happens to have one of the richest cultural histories in the world rather than just heritage destination.

Speaker A: Yeah, no, absolutely. Well with Egypt's heritage as well and culture, it's such a uh, um, such a rich story there, right? Uh, how would you say, um, developers can use that but without relying too much on cliches and not doing it too gimmicky that you can see in certain destinations. I won't name them.

Speaker B: Yeah, we're still seeing it quite a lot, aren't we? Um, those cliches. So I mean my view is that heritage should inspire design rather than define it. So, so today's traveler, they don't necessarily want like obvious historical references. They want authenticity expressed through um, you know, things like architecture and food and music and local experiences. Um, and you know, Egypt has an incredibly rich cultural DNA and the opportunity really is to express that through um, contemporary design and hospitality. Um, so yeah, I think it's finding the balance, isn't it without the cliche, but keeping, you know, heritage as an inspiration point for design and experience.

Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. Well, um, let's maybe go into the work that you do and Sector Light specifically. You often describe brand experience as more than marketing. Uh, right. So what should that experience look like, uh, across the customer journey?

Speaker B: Yeah. So, um, I mean, we believe that branding starts long before someone arrives. Right. So it begins really, uh, with the destination and how the development is positioned and it continues through every single touch point. So whether that's that first sort of digital interaction when someone's, you know, um, researching, um, you know, investment opportunities or the brochure or, you know, the sales presentation, um, or the sales gallery, um, then all the sort of digital experiences all the way through to like you know, the entire sort of customer journey of handover, um, and, you know, the. That. That experience as well. So every interact interaction either reinforces that promise or it weakens it. So consistency really for us, like our recommendation would always be to have consistency in the experience across every touch point. And we like to get involved quite early. Um, you know, often we get involved later when the project, you know, development team will present to us and say, this is, you know, this is what our vision is for the project. But actually there's a few projects that have been very successful where we've been involved much earlier in the master planning phase as well. Um, because branding really, you know, should start there and not be something that's added on, um, later on.

Speaker A: Yeah. Any perhaps project you particularly proud of or where that whole, um, journey has sort of developed into something really exciting that you can, um, talk through.

Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. So I think, um, one of the recent launches that we had was the Four Seasons of Residences, um, on Saadia island in Abu Dhabi. Um, and it was basically the last plot of land on that prime Saadiak beach. I've lived in the Middle East 20 years and that for me Sadiat beach is like the nicest, nice white powdery sand.

Speaker A: Yeah.

Speaker B: Um, and, you know, it's a lovely, you know, kilometers of um, clean beach. So that this was the last plot, um, and we got involved. We've been working with Elaine holding, um, you know, across various projects over the years. M And um, they got us involved quite early. Um, and we worked really, really closely with the developer and the brand, um, to really define a clear proposition. Um, and our proposition was all was rooted around sort of the nature, um, and, you know, the um, harmony of, um, you know, hearing those waves and being able to sort of walk along the beach and live that life. Um, and you know, we uh, created a beautiful campaign, um, a film which had um, music composed by an orchestra. Our vision was to have an orchestra performing on that Saadiat beach. So we recorded that and that became you know, our film. Um, and you know, potential buyers could really feel um, that symphony, um, of you know, music and sounds and experience on the Saadia beach.

Speaker A: Fascinating. Yeah, you were describing it and I was transported in that space. So m. I imagine it's pretty uh, special I guess connected to that as well. M. In my next question, wellness, it sort of now becomes such a standard in, in just luxury property. How do you think Egypt, uh, use its sort of climate, coast light and all the natural assets to create something more uh, distinctive in, in that wellness space?

Speaker B: Yeah, wellness is a real buzzword at the moment, isn't it? And every project is speaking about that. You know, they're going down that wellness route. So how do we really differentiate other. So wellness, um, you know, I think it is becoming less about the facilities, um, you know, the spa and all the physical facilities and more about the lifestyle. Um, and this, you know, this young generation of fire, extremely uh, you know, health conscious, um, and you know Egypt has a genuine competitive advantage through the climate that they have. You know that beautiful coastline and then they've got the desert landscape, um, and then year round sort of outdoor living as well. Um, so rather than simply adding another spa, um, you know, I feel that developers should design destinations where wellness is embedded um, into that everyday life through m. Because of, because of the climate there, I think, you know, walkability and nature and um, you know, outdoor experiences, um, you know that community living, um, and then things like healthy dining as well. Um, like you know, I think wellness really should be, should consider all of those things rather than just another spa, um, and those experiences, um, you know, people increasingly seek and they remember the, the actual experience rather than a physical service.

Speaker A: No, absolutely, absolutely. Well, uh, we've gone through quite a few questions as well. Is there before uh, we wrap up, is there anything that you know, we haven't covered, perhaps that uh, does excite you or in some of the work and the recent projects that you do that um, you thought would be interesting for um, for the audience and uh, um get a little bit more insights into that?

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean I think the only, the only other bit that we sort of haven't spoke about is the pace um, at which you know, development is happening, um, in Egypt. And um, you know, as I said, we're Working across a number of, of projects, mostly branded residences, but a couple of non branded projects as well. Um, and you know, we're kind of used to the Middle east way of working where you know, everything is really last minute and you know we need to launch in two months or three months. Um, but like with Egypt, it's literally um, you know, we need to launch in three weeks or four weeks rather than months. Um, so yeah, I think we're also learning a lot in trying to, you know, refine our processes to make sure that we can um, support developers and brands to get to market much quicker. Um, but yeah, I think, you know, it's as I said, it's really exciting times. And, and I think, you know, the other thing, there does need to be um, you know, a bit more education really in selling these sort of super premium um, projects. Um, because I think branded residences are still very new to Egypt and we are seeing that, you know, there's a gap there where you know, sales teams need to um, you know, kind of up, up there sort of level a little bit in terms of actually um, you know, being able to um, sell and target. I mean I think it's fine with local audiences and probably the gcc, um, audience because they've always been used to selling to those, but to, to actually go for international um, investors, um, I think there's still quite a lot of work and education to be done. It's happening, it's coming. So, uh. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker A: Well, what would, what would you say biggest advice based on all the work that you've done would uh, be for anyone sort of going into this market?

Speaker B: Um, you mean in terms of like developers wanting to.

Speaker A: Absolutely, yeah.

Speaker B: Investors.

Speaker A: Investors. Maybe. We are investment events. So I'd imagine that there's going to be a few people dialing in, looking to invest.

Speaker B: Yeah, I mean I think branded residences are a great opportunity, aren't they, for uh, investors to feel confident because they're backed and operated by um, you know, a renowned brand. Um, and um, you know, with it, with a new market that you know, historically hasn't attracted a lot of international investment, I think that you know that that will come go a long way and that's I guess why there's such a rise of branded residences projects coming up. Um, and obviously the sales premium does help as well. Um, both from a developer point of view and an investor point of view as well.

Speaker A: Exactly. Perfect. Super, super interesting discussion. Really appreciate it. Thank you so much Nina. And uh, I look forward to seeing you at one of our events.

Speaker B: Thank you, Daria. I'll see you in Dubai. And in Egypt as well.

Speaker A: Exactly. Perfect.

Speaker B: All right. Thank you. Thank you.