011 - Finding Your Next Great Superstar with Diane Wagner

Speaker A: According to the Society for Human resources, as of November 2021, an average of 3.9 million workers were quitting their job each month. This is known by many as the great Resignation. In fact, the US Bureau of Labor Statistics identified that employees between 30 and 45 years old had the greatest increase in resignation rates. Meaning mid career employees have set off in search for something more fulfilling. Now, whether this stems from build up tension as a result of COVID opportunities related to the new remote first world, or employees just hitting their breaking point from challenging work environments, this realignment of the workforce poses a unique opportunity for an industry struggling to attract talent like the insurance industry. That's why I think you'll really like my guest today, Diane Wagner. Dan. Diane is the chief Operating Officer for First Choice Agents Alliance. What I really admire about Diane is her purpose within this industry. Throughout today's interview, you'll sense her passion as relates to talent development and recruitment. And what I think is so exciting about today's session is that Diane will share a project that she has been collaborating on to help identify talent from outside the industry. Get those professionals trained quickly and effectively and placed within agencies who are looking for their next superstar. If you've been thinking about where your next hire is going to come from in today's ultra competitive environment, I think you're really going to like today's episode. And more importantly, stick around till the end of the show to learn about all the free resources she's going to be able to provide you that you can access right away and how you can get involved to help further this cause. I'm excited to bring you this episode. So here is my interview with Diane.

Speaker B: Welcome to the Beyond Insurance Podcast, a, uh, show dedicated to helping insurance industry professionals capture unrealized potential. That is what you are capable of becoming. Each episode, your host, Matt o' Neal, will bring you the leaders of this risk revolution. Thanks for joining us today. Now let the show begin.

Speaker C: Hi Diane. Thank you so much for joining me on the Beyond Interns podcast. How are you? Good, Matt.

Speaker D: How you doing?

Speaker C: Good. I am so, so excited about today's conversation because we are going to tackle probably one of the biggest issues that you and I both hear within the industry and that's all about talent acquisition. But before we get into that, uh, for people who do not know who you are, why don't you give us the background of, uh, who you are and how you got into this industry and who you're actually working with today to really change the way we bring talent into the industry.

Speaker D: Great, thanks, Matt. So again, my name is Diane Wagner. I'm the chief operating officer for First Choice Agents Alliance. I've been in the business 40 years this year, actually 41 this year. Uh, did 20 years on the company side. Actually started in the file department of an insurance company right out of high school at 18 years old, which was something I frankly didn't share for many years. It kind of leads into some of the conversations we're going to have today. Um, started an aggregator with another organization in 2001, spent 13 years there, did some sales coaching and CEO training for a number of years in between and then kind of met these folks by absolute happenstance at First Choice. Were in the process of converting nationwide agents from exclusive to captivity to independency and really created a program to help those folks see independency, um, in totality as they made the transition. So we're kind of, I hate to say experts, but we've got a really good program to help convert captive agents to independency. I think we're all hearing some rumblings that there might be more and more of that taking place in the future. But what I wanted to do very different in the network space that I think had ever been done before is this complete education deliverable around strategic planning and what is your why and creating a culture and working thoroughly on branding and marketing best practices. We're really dialed in with the big guy. We think a lot of those guys, um, sourcing talent. You know, we're going to talk a lot about today. Producer development, mergers and acquisitions. It's a terrific time for our folks to buy agencies so we're really helping them there and long term succession planning. So we're big strategic planning folks. We feel like that's a missing need in small business today, certainly in the independent insurance ranks. So that's kind of where our focus is. We, you know, we've got about 370 members, um, not looking to triple that number by any sense, but certainly looking for new opportunities and like to be there. As I said, you know, for folks that are looking to make the conversion, um, or independent agencies that are just looking to partner, um, and earn more revenue for their books of business. So that's kind of what we're about at first choice.

Speaker C: I love it. And I can attest I got to spend time with your agents, uh, late last year at one of your last conferences and they really are top notch and they really are looking to grow and you could even sense, I mean when you go to conferences you can kind of get the vibe of what the leadership team is trying to get across by the type of speakers they brought. And everything was really about trying to transform the agency so that they aren't that, uh, commoditized, standardized agency that we're seeing, you know, being bought up left and right in the industry today. And that's why today's conversation is going to be so perfect. Because it really, when you talk about why in culture that kind of stuff aligns so nicely with what beyond insurance is trying to do when it comes to how we're trying to impact the industry as well. But today I want to focus specifically on talent acquisition. One of the biggest challenges. And you're bringing these people transferring, uh, these agencies into independent agencies. But for them to be sustainable long term, they have to bring on the next generation of uh, uh, agents, account managers and everything in between. So you've done a lot of research in this area. You've been working heavily on tactics and strategies to help people, people find fresh talent. But let's start with the problem. Why do you think agencies aren't able to find fresh talent today? What's going on?

Speaker D: Well, you know, it's interesting. The big I did their national survey in 2020 and the number one concern raised by agents was, um, finding, sourcing, training and retaining talent. Right. So number one concern of agents throughout the nation. I think the great resignation hasn't helped. Right. So I think the stats that were done in 2020 would be so much worse today. Um, I think it's somewhat a lack of culture, uh, a lack of us talking about our industry. You know, I always say, and I know Matt, you and I have had this conversation in the past how insurance is the best kept secret and that, you know, it can't be that way any longer. I mean we all love what we do. Almost everyone I know in the industry can't even imagine doing anything else. We enjoy it so much. But I think our lack of um, energy and time spent on talking to the next generation about insurance as a career. And that's why there's just some really exciting things to share today. Culture. I think there's a culture disconnect. A lot of us are my age, right? You know, baby boomers that bootstrap it. This is how we did it. We just worked hard and you know, we're dealing with a different, we're dealing with a different generation of young people who are, are really interested in very different things. I don't know that we're as current as we need to be on compensation relative to competing with folks in the sales end. I don't think we do a very good job of testing, and I get a lot of pushback on testing, but the numbers speak for themselves. So we need to invest more time and energy and getting into our local communities and talking about how exciting a career in insurance can be. And as I said, there's a lot of really exciting things to talk about today that we're working on in that space.

Speaker C: Yeah. And I agree, um, whenever I speak with younger professionals about the insurance industry, uh, being 33. Right. So I'm right in the middle of that millennial pack. I always say one of the nicest things about it is you can really pick whatever industry you have a passion for. But you get like, the financial stability of the insurance industry. We even think of things like Covid. It hasn't really rocked the insurance industry too heavily like we've seen, unfortunately, with travel, hotels. Right. Hospitality, restaurants, all these other industries that people, I think, dive into. So it's a really great perspective and I totally agree. So what happens though? And I know, um, we can, we can make all sorts of assumptions, but I'd be curious to get your thoughts on this. Like, if we don't change the way we speak about the industry and the way the industry is perceived by outsiders, let's call them, what's going to happen, do you think, to the independent agency system or agents in general?

Speaker D: You know, it's interesting, uh, about 10 or 15 years ago, insurance Journal did an article on the, again, the demise of the independent agency and they really tied it to staffing and, you know, we kind of pooh, poohed it. And I think that we're closer to that moment than we ever have been before. And that really concerns me. I think there are a number of agencies struggling to find good customer service folks in their agency. Certainly good sales talent has been needle in the haystack type thing. But I think again, if we fast forward to this great resignation, it's become even more challenging. I think it's an all hands on deck moment. I have several calls to action today for the folks on this call, uh, from the carrier side, from the network side, from the independent agency side, I'm talking pulling people out of retirement to help. We all have to get involved because in absence of good customer service and salespeople in our independent agencies, everybody's going to be affected by this. And if it's folks that haven't had a staff upset in a while and then we see that In a lot of agencies where folks have been there forever. Again, because it's a great career, um, it's that one person you lose. And if you haven't had a reality check on being out in the hiring marketplace in a while, I'm afraid that there are folks in for a rude awakening. And we need to be developing that talent as we go so that we're not left without folks in our agencies. Mhm.

Speaker C: And so, uh, you mentioned all hands on deck. And that actually is sort of what stemmed this, uh, conversation initially and why I really was excited about having you on today's episode. Um, you're working and developing a program that is designed to tackle just that, bring fresh talent into the industry. Describe that program. What are you working on? Can you give us a sneak peek or behind the scenes?

Speaker D: Okay. There's actually a number of programs that we're working on. But the first and foremost, when I was a young person, I think maybe four, five years in the business, I just started an underwriting career. I got an opportunity to speak with a, with an organization called Invest. Invest is a nonprofit arm of Big I. They've been around for 25. Well, probably more than that, 35, 40 years, maybe even more. And the object of invest was always insurance and introduce insurance as a career to young people at the high school level so that they were making decisions about, uh, their college pursuits, they could be given the option to consider risk management and insurance. Um, I think what was missing in that, however, was the folks that maybe didn't have a career track to go towards the college level. And quite frankly, and some folks don't necessarily agree with me, but I don't know that college educated individuals are going to be really happy in the CSR ranks and agencies. So again, I felt like that there was this missing link. So a number of years ago, I had an opportunity to actually teach an INVEST class in a low income, business type high school environment in Rock Hill, South Carolina. We had 30 children in the class. And my idea was if we could get these kids interested, queue up a bunch of independent and quite frankly even captive agents at that time, and convince these children to consider internships in their sophomore, junior, senior year of high school, we could decide, do we like these kids? They could decide, am I going on to college? Do I want to stay here? Do we put them through licensing? Well, fast forward. We brought carriers in, we brought agents in. It was just the most, it was the coolest experience, right? To work with these kids and have them understand, as you said, all the Varied ways they could be involved. Be a drone pilot, you could be a loss control rep, you could be an actuary if you like to work with numbers, if you have sales acumen, ultimately you could create your own destiny as an agent and one day, quite frankly, supersede that agency. I mean I started 18 years old and I've been a part of some of the largest organizations in an ownership role in the Southeast. Right. So these things can still happen today. So fast forward at the end of this program, surprise to us, we had 19 children that wanted to participate. It was just the coolest thing ever. So that just kind of rebooted this love I've had for this organization invest. And I was able to kind of obtain through one of our carriers a seat on the board this year. So we're doing just a lot of really good work at invest, uh, and continuing the desire to introduce insurance as a career young people. But there's also been a shift to kind of focusing on the agency ranks. Uh, in addition to pushing folks to the collegiate level, there's also been a lot of workplace development work going on. So INVEST has always been here. What we're excited to announce today is uh, an agent kit that we've put together which gives folks the opportunity to understand how to reach out to schools. Because you know, Matt, everybody individual in the industry that I've ever said, would you give me an hour a month to further further this cause? Every one of them as always said, absolutely. But there's never been this coordinating effort of how do we exactly do that. So we've created this agent kit to show folks how to reach out to your local schools, to give them the curriculum to talk through in an hour long program on a career day, or as in being inserted into a classroom environment, quite frankly, there's an entire classroom environment for folks that really want to get involved like I did. And the neat thing about it is we can push the dialogue to risk management and insurance. But there's also an additional opportunity that is being called out for high schoolers and beyond. Ah, so invest, uh, program.org is where folks can find the just an amazing amount of resources. But uh, I'd like them to go to the insurance professional tab and pull down the information to show them how they can get involved with their local schools. Schedule time networks, get your agent scheduling time agents, get your staff helping to schedule time, get in the schools and talk about insurance's career. This information can also be be used in workplace development programs, which I think really presents a lot of Opportunities for what I want to talk about next, and that's Insure Academy. We have, um, a superior big guy in the state of North Carolina. They have created a program called Insure Academy. And what it basically is in a nutshell is an opportunity to take individuals, not just young people, but uh, teachers, transitioning moms trying to get back into the workforce. A six week program where individuals come out with certification and a license. And then Big Eye members in the state have an opportunity to bid hard for these candidates. And quite frankly, it has been exactly that. There's been 100% placement out of that program. Agencies so far have been thrilled with the folks that have come out of that program. There's another class starting next week. We're going to be also piloting a program in the state of South Carolina and ultimately with Invest help, our hope is that we create a national program for folks throughout the country to be able to throw people in the top of the funnel and have them come out again with a certification and a license. This is an absolute solution to the CSR crisis in our agencies, in our networks, wherever we need that. Hands on, um, on um, customer service in our agencies. And then obviously there'll be a producing talent that will come from there as well. There might be some folks that come out and decide that the carrier side is the better option. But think about this in the long term. So now I'm speaking to a classroom and um, obviously I'm pushing folks towards that risk management insurance track at the collegiate level. But I've also got the opportunity to say, hey, listen, if that's not a trap for you, you don't have the desire or the ability financially to go to college. You can come out of this program, you can graduate from high school, take this six week program and you come work for my agency. Right. So you're in the interim if you're a sophomore or junior and you'd like to come see my agency now as an intern, I'm happy to have you come work with me. That's something we didn't have before, Matt. We didn't have that deliverable. So we're as excited as we can be to have those tracks running from a customer service perspective. And then I know you're familiar with the ina. Um, we're meeting at the end of this month in Dallas, Texas. It's a group of networks getting together to solve the broader issues. We've actually a number of women executives in the network space have come together and created an organization we're calling Link and we're working solely on creating a turnkey program for our member agencies to source, test, fund, develop and train producing talent.

Speaker C: Wow.

Speaker D: So we hope at the end of the INA to have that program available to spin out to our members so that we can really start to develop some strong sales talent. So I know that's a lot, it's a lot of, um, things going on and at the same time.

Speaker C: So let me, let me summarize then, uh, some of the key points because then I have a follow up question to this, uh, directly related to the fact that you and I both manage networks of agencies. And so our core, one of our core responsibilities is making sure that these agencies are successful. Right. That their success is our success. Um, so a couple of things that you spoke about. You have a platform to educate young, uh, students on the value of the insurance industry and get them excited early on in their career through an internship program. You're also working on a secondary offering which takes people outside of the industry that are adults, uh, who might be looking for some sort of potential career and want. Almost like that. I almost think of it like a trade school, like fast Pass education for people who want to get all the education very quickly but be able to get into the industry very successfully as well. And then in the third point that you brought up, which again this is going to tie into my question is that you're working with other network leaders to develop some sort of process that they can use to begin educate and source talent that then can be brought back into the network. Are, uh, those really the three key things that you hit home on?

Speaker D: That's correct.

Speaker C: Awesome. So, um, A, how do you have time to sleep? But B, um, M, my big question is it goes back to both you and I running networks. You know, we really focus on that customer experience differentiation. You obviously are working really heavily because you can, you can sense it when you talk about it. Your, why is really getting this next generation and the succession of the independent agency system going? Um, if I'm running a network, whether it's a small local cluster with maybe five or six agencies that's just getting off the ground, or maybe it's one of the largest ones. Like, I know we're friends with David Ward at Iroquois Group, right?

Speaker D: Yeah.

Speaker C: Uh, what can a network leader be doing to either take it, take, take, uh, advantage of all the resources that you're now providing to the industry to help us all, or what could I be doing as a network leader myself to kind of replicate all this, this excellence that you've been able to create.

Speaker D: Well, this isn't, this isn't a closely held secret. So I think the first thing there's a, there are a number of things that we can. First and foremost, I encourage all networks to do what we did early last year and that's Adopt Invest as our charitable partner of choice. We made a sizable donation to the organization early in the year and then at our annual meeting we did a silent auction and matched that number for the investor organization. So I think all networks should have a terrible cause. I think this one makes absolutely perfect sense because as a group if we can raise enough funds to fund another staff person for them, we're going to be able to get these offerings national more quickly where each and every one of you can offer that solution, um, to your member agencies. So invest program.org uh, get involved with those folks. Donate, use the resources so that agent speaker kit is there for all it's public on their website. Secondly, I think we as networks need to encourage all of our members to be um, partners with the big I and look at big I hires and all of the resources that organization brings to bear. That is a no brainer, um, to be a big I member. And the insure academy nc.com uh, is the website that you'll go to if you're in the state of North Carolina and soon South Carolina, insure academync.com, you can kind of take a look at that program and start using that as a feeder system now. So I think we need to be encouraging our folks to get hands on and out into their local schools or um, community workplace to talk about insurance as a career and to really be looking to provide either internships or hiring from the school systems. Um, and if they have, they have opportunities to work even more closely with school systems, Invest is kind of a driver to give them the information they need to even build their own insurance programs in their local schools. So you know, it's kind of interesting. There's a company in uh, upstate New York where I'm from called Dryden Mutual, Little Mutual Insurance Company. They've been around forever and ever. They've been Invest partners for 35 years and they get 25 to 30% of their employees through Invest programs with partnerships in three schools in the area. And the agents become local feeders for that program as well. We're trying to replicate that with carriers throughout the nation. Our second will be Frederick Mutual out of Frederick, Maryland. We've got a number of agents up there and um, the president of Frederick Mutual is very interested and replicating what Dryden has done. So there are so many ways that you as a leader can get your folks involved, I think by choosing INVEST as our charity of choice. And I don't know if you were there at the meeting when we kicked all that off, but there was just a tremendous amount of people wanting to get involved over and above the silent auction, really interested in speaking in their schools and developing young people again, because I think so many of us enjoy this business so much. M. There was an article that was just written, I don't know if you saw. I posted on my LinkedIn page this week by an organization called riskandinsurance.com and it was titled why Insurance and Risk Management is a Great Career. And it was probably one of the better articles I've ever seen. Um, and There were like 10 subcategories on why young people should choose insurance as a career. I really encourage folks to pull that article down as well. Um, and use that with the INVEST materials, as I said, to get out and just make this not the best kept secret anymore. We've got 500,000 people retiring in the next five years. That is going to be an insurmountable goal to replicate those bodies in both agencies and companies. So everyone should be on board. Everyone should be concerned.

Speaker C: Yeah, I love it. And what I will do, uh, in the show notes, we'll link to that article that you referenced that. Absolutely. So, Diane, this has been so insightful and, uh, I was not surprised at all that you were able to bring this much value and that you are running, as I said, like a million miles an hour. But what I love about this conversation is you. As I said, you can really sense your why. You can really see that this is a pattern passion of yours. And what you're doing is such a huge need in the industry today. Um, so someone's listening and, uh, this is my last question as we wrap up today's session. Someone's listening today. They like it, they get it. They need that next generation of talent. The podcast ends. What is one thing that they should be doing, whether they're either. And it could be. I mean, we have business development professionals, we have agency leaders, we have carriers, network people. Right? What is, uh, what is the next thing someone should be doing from your perspective to really get this ball rolling in the right direction for them personally or their agency?

Speaker D: Well, I really do think there's a very specific call to action and it really does depend, Matt, where you are in the journey and frankly, where you Work. So I would say for agents, independent agents, download the speaker kit, commit yourself to speaking in the schools once a quarter for companies, company people, for companies that support invest. Thank you for supporting Invest, but I think this is the year where maybe we consider up and up the uh, contribution we've made so that we can get this kind of a capital call, we can get this unit built out so that we can make this deliverable national. From, um, an agent, back to an agent's perspective. Join the big I, from a network perspective, you really, I think we need to do a better job of pushing the big guy. We've got a tremendous amount of penetration in our organization. I know a lot of networks do. But really push the big guy. And look at big I hires, um, back Invest not just at the carrier level, we're certainly reaching out to many carriers as we can, but the network level. I think again, every network should have a charity of choice and Invest just makes perfect sense to me. Member agencies, if you're looking to contribute, there is a donation, um, opportunity on the Invest site. Uh, and then North Carolina and South Carolina people go to insureacademync.com, listen to the video, listen to the testimonials, talk to people in your community, put this information on your social media. This is awesome. Social media. To share that article on risk management and insurance. Everybody should post. Share it like crazy. The neat thing about being in the classroom too is the leave behind. It might not be the students that have an interest. It might be their parents. It could be their extended family or someone they know that's looking for a new career that might be teaching. As much as we hate to take teachers away from what they do, um, moms that are looking to get back into the business. So we need to spread our net far and wide. It's an all hands on deck moment. Pull your friends out of retirement, they're probably bored anyway. And let's get more folks pushing this initiative. It's a critical moment in time. I think you guys do great work and I love how you use this as a platform and I appreciate the time today. I really think we can start a movement and solve this problem before it's even worse than it is today.

Speaker C: Yeah, Diane, I 100% agree with what you're saying. So I'm sure you're going to have someone that says, hey, I want to help, I want to jump in. What is the best way for someone to contact you? Or perhaps even First Choice agents Alliance, if they want to learn more about what you have going on and how they can get involved.

Speaker D: Well, our website for folks considering potential membership is www.fcaalliance.com investprogram M.org, as I said, is always looking for assistance. Folks that want to reach out to me directly can do so through our website. Um, insure academync.com folks in the Carolinas that might have interested people in their organization that need licensing or folks that they might be able to drive to that. Uh, anyone you know, we've got big diversity actions that we're looking for as well. So anyone that's involved at a national level and diverse organizations that we could bring these programs to. Um, we have a diversity issue in this industry, as we all know. Uh, and we're working very hard under all of these organizations to kind of increase diversity across the scope of our organization. So I'm always here to help. I know you guys are always here to help. Let's start a movement.

Speaker C: Awesome. I love it. Well, Dan, thank you so much again for joining me on today's show. I really appreciate it, and I know the viewers will, too.

Speaker D: All right, thanks, Matt.

Speaker C: Thank you.

Speaker A: Diane, thank you again for joining me on the Beyond Insurance podcast. One of the biggest things that I took away from this discussion was really the opportunity. The opportunity there is to bring fresh eyes into this industry. And as we continue to make this industry larger and more diverse and get more outside perspectives. I know, and I hope that you would agree, all of you listeners, that this industry is only going to get more and more amazing. So I really encourage you to take advantage of the resources Diane and the rest of her team have put together to help tell the story of this industry and really what this industry is all about. And that's protecting the community, protecting the people around us. So dive into the resources. I put links in the description of this podcast. Download them. If you have questions, please reach out to Diane or any member of the Beyond Insurance team. We will make sure we connect you with the right people. Signing off. I'll see you in the next episode.

Speaker C: Matt o', Neal, thanks for joining us.

Speaker B: Uh, on, um, the Beyond Insurance podcast. Make sure to Visit our website, BeyondInsurance.com where you can subscribe to this show using your favorite podcasting platform. While you're there, consider assessing your unrealized growth potential using one of our free self assessments designed to help you maximize your performance. If you found this episode valuable, we'd appreciate a rating on itunes. Or if you'd simply tell a friend about the show, that would help us out, too. Be sure to tune in next time. And remember, your success comes when you maximize your potential through process thinking and process improvement.