187 - Product-Led Growth Meets Agentic Selling - with Channing Ferrer

1 00:00:32,489 --> 00:00:34,329 SPEAKER_01: Welcome to Product Led Growth Leaders. 2 00:00:34,409 --> 00:00:37,609 We've got a great guest for the show today, Channing Ferrer. 3 00:00:38,009 --> 00:00:39,289 He is a revenue guy. 4 00:00:39,449 --> 00:00:42,729 He's had an extensive background in sales and finance. 5 00:00:42,890 --> 00:00:48,089 And he is today the chief revenue officer and CEO Americas 6 00:00:48,409 --> 00:00:53,129 of Brevo, the CRM suite manifesting tomorrow's success. 7 00:00:53,289 --> 00:00:54,890 Channing, welcome to the show. 8 00:00:55,129 --> 00:00:55,849 Thank you, Thomas. 9 00:00:56,009 --> 00:00:56,809 Excited to be here. 10 00:00:57,129 --> 00:00:58,409 Yeah, excited to have you. 11 00:00:58,569 --> 00:01:03,049 So let's talk a little bit first about your role here in just 12 00:01:03,049 --> 00:01:06,569 sort of the startup space, the software world. 13 00:01:06,810 --> 00:01:09,129 You have an extensive background in revenue. 14 00:01:09,289 --> 00:01:12,729 And I always like talking to revenue people because you have 15 00:01:12,729 --> 00:01:16,329 a lot to say about sales and how companies sustain themselves. 16 00:01:16,569 --> 00:01:20,489 So opening thoughts on that before I dive into subtopics 17 00:01:20,569 --> 00:01:20,889 there. 18 00:01:21,209 --> 00:01:22,409 SPEAKER_00: Yes, definitely, definitely. 19 00:01:22,569 --> 00:01:26,250 And by means of experience, I've been in and around the revenue 20 00:01:26,250 --> 00:01:27,609 world for a long time here. 21 00:01:27,930 --> 00:01:30,169 But in a lot of product-led growth businesses. 22 00:01:30,329 --> 00:01:32,729 And I think one of the things that's always interesting is how 23 00:01:32,729 --> 00:01:37,049 to balance that sales-led motion with that product-led motion and 24 00:01:37,049 --> 00:01:39,929 where those two things come together, where they collide, 25 00:01:40,090 --> 00:01:42,409 where they conflict even sometimes. 26 00:01:42,969 --> 00:01:44,009 But it's been fun. 27 00:01:44,090 --> 00:01:47,450 I think when I look back at some of the experiences beyond Brevo 28 00:01:47,530 --> 00:01:50,890 at HubSpot at SEMrush, that were all very product-like growth 29 00:01:50,890 --> 00:01:53,450 businesses, there's a lot of really interesting learnings. 30 00:01:53,609 --> 00:01:56,170 And there's a big evolution that I'm seeing also. 31 00:01:56,329 --> 00:01:58,729 I think, of course, with automation and AI. 32 00:01:58,810 --> 00:02:01,289 There's a lot of things we used to do that we didn't call AI, 33 00:02:01,369 --> 00:02:03,689 that today you might call it that. 34 00:02:04,170 --> 00:02:05,929 But we just called it automation. 35 00:02:06,170 --> 00:02:07,530 And now it's AI. 36 00:02:07,609 --> 00:02:10,250 But uh the fundamentals, I think, have been around for a 37 00:02:10,250 --> 00:02:10,490 while. 38 00:02:10,569 --> 00:02:11,930 It's just how we execute on those. 39 00:02:12,090 --> 00:02:13,530 We've gotten much more efficient. 40 00:02:14,090 --> 00:02:16,250 SPEAKER_01: Literally, Channing, I have been thinking about 41 00:02:16,250 --> 00:02:18,889 making a list, and I'm sure someone's probably already done 42 00:02:18,889 --> 00:02:22,649 it, of things that if they were invented in the past couple of 43 00:02:22,649 --> 00:02:24,170 years, we would call AI. 44 00:02:24,250 --> 00:02:26,889 And it would, I think it would include things like cruise 45 00:02:26,889 --> 00:02:27,689 control, right? 46 00:02:29,129 --> 00:02:32,409 Just anything, um, anything that just kind of on its own has 47 00:02:32,409 --> 00:02:34,250 something that's hilarious. 48 00:02:34,490 --> 00:02:38,729 Um, and so uh let's let's talk about that the PLG insights 49 00:02:38,729 --> 00:02:42,490 there, because PLG, I don't know where you would put the birth 50 00:02:42,490 --> 00:02:44,009 date on it of recently. 51 00:02:44,090 --> 00:02:46,169 Is it past 12 years? 52 00:02:46,329 --> 00:02:48,729 Is it something something in that range makes sense? 53 00:02:48,969 --> 00:02:52,169 Something in that kind of range ish where people started 54 00:02:52,169 --> 00:02:54,329 realizing and putting a vocabulary to it. 55 00:02:54,490 --> 00:02:57,129 I think people had been doing things around it and realized 56 00:02:57,129 --> 00:03:00,169 things, but it got a vocabulary, it got a methodology. 57 00:03:00,409 --> 00:03:04,250 Let's start with I I want to end with a I want to do a contrast 58 00:03:04,250 --> 00:03:09,530 between PLG of yesteryear and PLG today, but let's first get 59 00:03:09,530 --> 00:03:14,009 grounded on sort of what PLG classically is uh from your 60 00:03:14,009 --> 00:03:16,569 perspective and then like lead that into today. 61 00:03:16,889 --> 00:03:17,689 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, definitely. 62 00:03:17,770 --> 00:03:20,729 So I think there's a fundamental definition that I think of as 63 00:03:20,729 --> 00:03:23,849 PLG, which I don't always know if everyone agrees up to this, 64 00:03:23,930 --> 00:03:25,049 but uh I'll explain it. 65 00:03:25,210 --> 00:03:30,569 I think PLG is really having the product lead you down a path to 66 00:03:30,729 --> 00:03:32,090 uh realize more value. 67 00:03:32,250 --> 00:03:34,569 That value turns into probably buying more products. 68 00:03:34,810 --> 00:03:39,530 PLG in my mind is not a 15-day free trial. 69 00:03:39,689 --> 00:03:41,129 That's that's a different motion. 70 00:03:41,289 --> 00:03:45,449 Um PLG means you don't need humans involved to to decide to 71 00:03:45,449 --> 00:03:48,169 do more, to see more value, to realize you know what you're 72 00:03:48,169 --> 00:03:48,969 doing with the product. 73 00:03:49,049 --> 00:03:52,250 Uh at times humans can help with PLG, but it really should be a 74 00:03:52,250 --> 00:03:54,810 product-led motion, not a not a human-led motion. 75 00:03:54,889 --> 00:03:57,370 And I think sometimes the there's a misconception out 76 00:03:57,370 --> 00:04:00,250 there uh that's been around for a while, by the way, that if you 77 00:04:00,250 --> 00:04:03,530 put a 15-day, 30-day trial on your website, now you're 78 00:04:03,530 --> 00:04:05,689 product-led, that's a very different motion. 79 00:04:06,009 --> 00:04:06,250 SPEAKER_01: Right. 80 00:04:06,409 --> 00:04:10,009 And you know, and coming from uh the design and UX background 81 00:04:10,009 --> 00:04:15,770 myself, I have always viewed the overlap between product strategy 82 00:04:15,770 --> 00:04:19,210 and UX as having lots of PLG in it, right? 83 00:04:19,449 --> 00:04:23,370 And so, you know, I've always described it to people as make 84 00:04:23,449 --> 00:04:27,689 the pro in terms of product work, make the product so good 85 00:04:28,329 --> 00:04:32,569 that it has its own gravity and starts pulling in more success 86 00:04:32,569 --> 00:04:35,370 to where you're not depending on all of these other channels, but 87 00:04:35,370 --> 00:04:38,889 you want one of the main channels, the product itself, to 88 00:04:38,889 --> 00:04:42,009 be strong with uh your ability to get revenue. 89 00:04:42,250 --> 00:04:43,930 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, exactly. 90 00:04:44,090 --> 00:04:47,370 Well, one of the things uh that I was interested to chat a 91 00:04:47,370 --> 00:04:49,769 little bit about today, Thomas, as we think about these things, 92 00:04:50,009 --> 00:04:52,809 is um how PLG is expanding. 93 00:04:52,889 --> 00:04:56,809 And it's very specifically now we can automate the human 94 00:04:56,809 --> 00:04:58,250 elements of selling, actually. 95 00:04:58,409 --> 00:05:01,929 So what what I get at is there's uh a product we're using now, 96 00:05:02,009 --> 00:05:05,370 actually, where you have an AI bot that will give you a demo. 97 00:05:05,450 --> 00:05:08,169 And that demo isn't just a uh YouTube recording. 98 00:05:08,330 --> 00:05:10,009 That demo is a customized demo. 99 00:05:10,090 --> 00:05:12,649 You can engage with it, you can talk to it, it'll show you 100 00:05:12,649 --> 00:05:13,289 different things. 101 00:05:13,450 --> 00:05:14,809 Is that PLG? 102 00:05:14,970 --> 00:05:17,929 Is that sales led, or is that some new concept that we want to 103 00:05:17,929 --> 00:05:20,330 call agent-led maybe uh selling? 104 00:05:20,409 --> 00:05:23,289 But there's there's, you know, we created all these automations 105 00:05:23,289 --> 00:05:26,730 and leveraging AI, but we can really take that pretty far now 106 00:05:26,730 --> 00:05:27,610 in the sales motion. 107 00:05:27,689 --> 00:05:29,769 And it's interesting to see where that fits in, if it's 108 00:05:29,769 --> 00:05:31,769 categorizes PLG or not. 109 00:05:32,169 --> 00:05:34,490 SPEAKER_01: It's kind of in the same spirit of it, right? 110 00:05:34,570 --> 00:05:37,529 Because the whole point of or part of the point of PLG is 111 00:05:37,529 --> 00:05:41,850 you're not dumping as many human and financial resources into the 112 00:05:41,850 --> 00:05:46,009 selling part as you are as making the product um in better 113 00:05:46,009 --> 00:05:46,409 shape. 114 00:05:46,570 --> 00:05:51,129 But then it seems like a cousin to that to say, like, hey, we 115 00:05:51,129 --> 00:05:55,610 can also put money into these sort of tertiary systems around 116 00:05:55,610 --> 00:05:59,450 the product that kind of help like it's sort of like passive 117 00:05:59,450 --> 00:06:00,250 income, isn't it? 118 00:06:00,330 --> 00:06:04,250 Where you're just you want the the thing to do the selling. 119 00:06:04,490 --> 00:06:05,689 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly. 120 00:06:05,850 --> 00:06:06,250 Exactly. 121 00:06:06,409 --> 00:06:09,049 And you know, one of the things at Brevo we look closely at is 122 00:06:09,129 --> 00:06:12,490 we think of our uh self-serve, we call it, our self-serve 123 00:06:12,490 --> 00:06:12,970 motion. 124 00:06:13,049 --> 00:06:16,009 Uh, within that self-serve motion, we have what we call 125 00:06:16,009 --> 00:06:18,730 autonomous selling, where you know, customers will buy on 126 00:06:18,730 --> 00:06:21,370 their own, but they're buying a product that is otherwise 127 00:06:21,370 --> 00:06:21,850 sales-led. 128 00:06:22,090 --> 00:06:23,529 And then we have our sales-led motion. 129 00:06:23,689 --> 00:06:27,049 So the autonomous selling is this kind of gray area that fits 130 00:06:27,049 --> 00:06:30,330 between PLG and our world, PLG and self-serve are kind of the 131 00:06:30,330 --> 00:06:30,730 same thing. 132 00:06:30,889 --> 00:06:33,769 But the autonomous selling is something that we're seeing kind 133 00:06:33,769 --> 00:06:34,330 of pick up. 134 00:06:34,490 --> 00:06:36,809 And what's interesting is I'll go back to when I was at 135 00:06:36,809 --> 00:06:37,370 HubSpot. 136 00:06:37,610 --> 00:06:40,730 One of the things we did at HubSpot is we had this big um 137 00:06:40,730 --> 00:06:41,689 chat team. 138 00:06:41,850 --> 00:06:44,330 And of course, now we could automate all this or most of it, 139 00:06:44,409 --> 00:06:47,689 but we had this big chat team as over 100 people, and they were 140 00:06:47,689 --> 00:06:49,769 chatting with folks who hadn't purchased yet. 141 00:06:49,850 --> 00:06:53,289 So they were using either free users or just on the website. 142 00:06:53,529 --> 00:06:56,009 We were answering their questions, and it was our best 143 00:06:56,009 --> 00:06:56,649 lead source. 144 00:06:56,809 --> 00:07:00,009 And we were, they set in sales, they reported to me, but they 145 00:07:00,009 --> 00:07:01,769 weren't incentivized like salespeople. 146 00:07:01,850 --> 00:07:04,970 They were incentivized just to answer questions, but we taught 147 00:07:04,970 --> 00:07:07,289 them how to answer questions that would lead to leads. 148 00:07:07,450 --> 00:07:09,529 You know, so they they kind of learned how to do this. 149 00:07:09,689 --> 00:07:11,370 There wasn't a sales incentive there. 150 00:07:11,610 --> 00:07:12,970 We don't want them to feel salesy. 151 00:07:13,210 --> 00:07:16,090 Um, now we're able to automate, of course, that with AI. 152 00:07:16,169 --> 00:07:19,370 So at Brevo, for example, we have uh a chat tool, an AI 153 00:07:19,370 --> 00:07:21,769 chatbot, that we use, our customers use. 154 00:07:22,009 --> 00:07:24,889 And it's a lot of what we were doing back at HelpSpot, but 155 00:07:24,889 --> 00:07:26,570 again, it's in a very automated way. 156 00:07:26,730 --> 00:07:30,090 But the purpose, I think, behind that is to help and provide 157 00:07:30,090 --> 00:07:31,210 insights and guidance. 158 00:07:31,289 --> 00:07:35,529 It's not to sell, but in doing that, you can you can teach that 159 00:07:35,529 --> 00:07:37,450 tool to be very product-led. 160 00:07:37,929 --> 00:07:40,889 Um, Jason Lemkin talks a lot about this actually at Saster. 161 00:07:41,049 --> 00:07:43,689 He does a lot of kind of similar stuff even on his website, where 162 00:07:43,689 --> 00:07:46,570 he has chatbots all over the place helping support those 163 00:07:46,570 --> 00:07:49,529 customers who have questions about conferences and things. 164 00:07:49,610 --> 00:07:52,409 And he said it's his best lead source as well. 165 00:07:52,809 --> 00:07:54,409 SPEAKER_01: Okay, so this is fascinating. 166 00:07:54,649 --> 00:07:56,409 Is this what you guys do at Brevo? 167 00:07:56,889 --> 00:07:58,809 Is it's the automated selling piece? 168 00:07:59,129 --> 00:08:00,809 SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's one of the things that we do. 169 00:08:00,889 --> 00:08:04,009 You know, we do a whole variety of things when you get into kind 170 00:08:04,009 --> 00:08:06,970 of how you engage from a marketing or selling standpoint. 171 00:08:07,129 --> 00:08:09,529 But I think this area is really interesting because it overlaps 172 00:08:09,529 --> 00:08:14,009 a lot with you know, product led and this idea of how do we help 173 00:08:14,009 --> 00:08:17,929 a soon-to-be customer, a prospect, I suppose, to learn 174 00:08:17,929 --> 00:08:18,970 more about your product. 175 00:08:19,049 --> 00:08:22,169 Yeah, and either they're already using it in some capacity and 176 00:08:22,169 --> 00:08:24,570 they might want to buy more, they might want to do more, or 177 00:08:24,570 --> 00:08:25,769 they're not using it yet. 178 00:08:25,929 --> 00:08:28,090 But ultimately, the idea of I think doing this through an 179 00:08:28,090 --> 00:08:29,850 automated way is really interesting. 180 00:08:30,009 --> 00:08:33,850 And that's this, I think the new evolution probably of PLG is 181 00:08:33,850 --> 00:08:37,129 this agent support element to it. 182 00:08:37,450 --> 00:08:40,330 SPEAKER_01: How uh prevalent and how effective are these kinds of 183 00:08:40,330 --> 00:08:40,570 tools? 184 00:08:40,730 --> 00:08:44,409 So I've seen a bunch of tools where, you know, it's 185 00:08:44,409 --> 00:08:48,730 essentially a chat bot on a website, and there's a bunch of 186 00:08:48,730 --> 00:08:51,689 companies that have sprung up kind of doing things that 187 00:08:51,689 --> 00:08:54,649 overlap, where you change train the bot. 188 00:08:54,730 --> 00:08:57,529 And I don't know if it's like you say, hey, here's all of our 189 00:08:57,529 --> 00:08:58,570 company PDFs. 190 00:08:58,649 --> 00:09:01,129 So you can now answer our questions, and here's like an 191 00:09:01,129 --> 00:09:03,529 interview with the founder or something like that, right? 192 00:09:03,689 --> 00:09:06,969 Um, and you train it up, and then people go to the website 193 00:09:07,049 --> 00:09:11,209 and the chat bot somehow surfaces, and the person is able 194 00:09:11,209 --> 00:09:12,329 to make an interaction. 195 00:09:12,490 --> 00:09:17,209 Then the idea is you lead this uh to where you need it to be to 196 00:09:17,209 --> 00:09:18,649 push the pipeline forward. 197 00:09:18,889 --> 00:09:19,850 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly. 198 00:09:20,009 --> 00:09:22,490 So you can use it a lot of different ways, but I think what 199 00:09:22,490 --> 00:09:25,449 you're saying is exactly a very good use case where someone has 200 00:09:25,449 --> 00:09:28,569 a question, and that could be they're maybe they're a free 201 00:09:28,569 --> 00:09:31,209 user right now and they're using them and they've hit a limit on 202 00:09:31,529 --> 00:09:33,689 a feature and they have a question that hey, I've hit this 203 00:09:33,689 --> 00:09:33,929 limit. 204 00:09:34,009 --> 00:09:35,209 What are my options now? 205 00:09:35,449 --> 00:09:38,490 Can I do I this limit reset next month? 206 00:09:38,649 --> 00:09:40,009 You know, what if I want to buy more? 207 00:09:40,169 --> 00:09:41,769 Can I pay overage charges? 208 00:09:41,929 --> 00:09:44,409 All those sorts of things the bot can answer, obviously, very 209 00:09:44,409 --> 00:09:44,730 quickly. 210 00:09:44,809 --> 00:09:46,730 You don't need to talk to a human to figure that out. 211 00:09:46,889 --> 00:09:49,929 They figure out, oh, maybe I just need to go to the starter 212 00:09:49,929 --> 00:09:50,649 tier, let's call it. 213 00:09:50,809 --> 00:09:53,289 Starter tier only cost me$15 a month. 214 00:09:53,370 --> 00:09:55,129 Great, I'll upgrade to the starter tier. 215 00:09:55,289 --> 00:09:57,449 Now, of course, the bot helped facilitate that. 216 00:09:57,610 --> 00:10:00,649 In the past, they might have had to go look through help content 217 00:10:00,649 --> 00:10:01,689 to try to figure that out. 218 00:10:01,850 --> 00:10:05,610 They may have called a support number, which uh may or may not 219 00:10:05,610 --> 00:10:07,129 have helped them to answer that question. 220 00:10:07,289 --> 00:10:10,089 But again, this idea of kind of automating that real time. 221 00:10:10,250 --> 00:10:12,730 And in today's day and age, we don't have patience for 222 00:10:12,730 --> 00:10:12,969 anything. 223 00:10:13,049 --> 00:10:14,889 So you want to get that answer immediately. 224 00:10:14,969 --> 00:10:18,409 And that's what helps you to convert the customer into that, 225 00:10:18,490 --> 00:10:21,610 you know, that higher, higher tier uh grade, I think, or 226 00:10:21,610 --> 00:10:22,969 higher grade kind of product that you have. 227 00:10:23,129 --> 00:10:25,289 So I think that real-time solution to really what they 228 00:10:25,289 --> 00:10:28,250 want to hear is I think where the chat bot fits in really 229 00:10:28,250 --> 00:10:30,490 well, you know, just one use case, but it fits really nicely 230 00:10:30,490 --> 00:10:31,129 to PLG. 231 00:10:31,289 --> 00:10:31,449 I think. 232 00:10:31,769 --> 00:10:34,250 SPEAKER_01: So let's dip our toes into the world of Brevo a 233 00:10:34,250 --> 00:10:38,409 little bit in, you know, what is the um user experience like for 234 00:10:38,409 --> 00:10:38,889 the company? 235 00:10:39,049 --> 00:10:42,649 So your target, I assume, is companies that uh are selling 236 00:10:42,649 --> 00:10:44,730 things, they need some kind of a sales pipeline. 237 00:10:44,889 --> 00:10:46,329 Um, you know, it's the CRM. 238 00:10:46,409 --> 00:10:50,649 Is it is it sort of a broad CRM experience where you're trying 239 00:10:50,649 --> 00:10:52,490 to give them the functionality they need? 240 00:10:52,809 --> 00:10:55,850 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so we we fit um mostly for B2C. 241 00:10:56,009 --> 00:10:58,569 We do have B2B customers that use us, but we're a little more 242 00:10:58,569 --> 00:11:00,089 oriented towards B2C. 243 00:11:00,329 --> 00:11:02,730 So you have high volumes of customers. 244 00:11:02,889 --> 00:11:05,289 We're an omni-channel marketing platform. 245 00:11:05,449 --> 00:11:08,969 Um, and so people will use us, our customers will use us to 246 00:11:08,969 --> 00:11:11,610 help them with their marketing, how they engage with their 247 00:11:11,610 --> 00:11:12,569 customers ultimately. 248 00:11:12,809 --> 00:11:16,329 Being B2C, you typically have a very large grouping of prospects 249 00:11:16,329 --> 00:11:17,529 and customers that you want to think about. 250 00:11:17,610 --> 00:11:19,929 So you have big databases of people. 251 00:11:20,089 --> 00:11:23,769 And usually it's a lower value product in the sense that 252 00:11:23,769 --> 00:11:27,370 they're selling something that's not you know$50,000 a year. 253 00:11:27,449 --> 00:11:30,169 It's gonna be maybe$550,$55. 254 00:11:30,649 --> 00:11:32,889 You know, it could be whatever that price point is, but it's 255 00:11:32,889 --> 00:11:35,370 gonna be where you're not gonna have humans selling the product. 256 00:11:35,449 --> 00:11:38,649 You're gonna have, you know, a retail type or e-commerce type 257 00:11:38,649 --> 00:11:39,049 experience. 258 00:11:39,289 --> 00:11:42,009 So we're helping them with how they engage with these 259 00:11:42,009 --> 00:11:42,730 customers. 260 00:11:42,889 --> 00:11:45,610 And some customers like to engage through email, some 261 00:11:45,610 --> 00:11:49,049 customers like to engage through walking into a store and getting 262 00:11:49,209 --> 00:11:52,409 maybe a push notification or having a discount available to 263 00:11:52,409 --> 00:11:54,649 them or through loyalty elements of what they do. 264 00:11:54,809 --> 00:11:58,329 So omni-channel engagement means anything from email to WhatsApp 265 00:11:58,409 --> 00:12:00,569 to SMS to other mechanisms. 266 00:12:00,730 --> 00:12:03,769 But of course, going back to what I was talking about, the 267 00:12:03,769 --> 00:12:07,129 idea of engaging through the website experience, of course, 268 00:12:07,209 --> 00:12:08,169 is a part of that. 269 00:12:08,409 --> 00:12:11,929 And um, you know, we can we can help with those different types 270 00:12:11,929 --> 00:12:13,529 of engagements in different ways. 271 00:12:13,689 --> 00:12:17,129 And I think what's interesting, and I think this is um so 272 00:12:17,129 --> 00:12:21,129 prevalent across B2B and B2C today, is that everyone likes to 273 00:12:21,129 --> 00:12:21,929 buy a little differently. 274 00:12:22,089 --> 00:12:24,169 Everyone educates themselves a little bit differently. 275 00:12:24,329 --> 00:12:27,129 We have a lot more information available, but we're not all 276 00:12:27,129 --> 00:12:28,169 buying the same way. 277 00:12:28,329 --> 00:12:33,129 So the way that we need to um uh sell products needs to be 278 00:12:33,129 --> 00:12:34,409 customized, actually. 279 00:12:34,569 --> 00:12:37,289 And one person likes to buy one way, another person likes to buy 280 00:12:37,289 --> 00:12:37,529 another. 281 00:12:37,689 --> 00:12:41,929 One person is more educating themselves through um Chat GPT, 282 00:12:42,009 --> 00:12:44,490 where someone else likes to go walk around the mall to learn 283 00:12:44,490 --> 00:12:45,129 about products. 284 00:12:45,289 --> 00:12:47,529 And again, I think it's so important to be able to kind of 285 00:12:47,529 --> 00:12:50,649 create that tailored customized experience for how you engage 286 00:12:50,649 --> 00:12:51,529 with your customer base. 287 00:12:51,610 --> 00:12:53,209 So that's a lot of what we ultimately do. 288 00:12:53,610 --> 00:12:56,089 SPEAKER_01: And you're ultimately creating uh two 289 00:12:56,169 --> 00:12:57,850 levels of experience, aren't you? 290 00:12:58,089 --> 00:13:01,929 Because you have to um there's the direct user who is the 291 00:13:01,929 --> 00:13:03,209 company trying to sell. 292 00:13:03,370 --> 00:13:07,049 And then I don't know how much thought you guys give or into 293 00:13:07,209 --> 00:13:10,649 the final end user who's gonna be the person logging onto your 294 00:13:10,649 --> 00:13:13,129 client's website, your customer's website to buy 295 00:13:13,129 --> 00:13:15,769 things, but it but it's kind of that multi-tiered thing, isn't 296 00:13:15,769 --> 00:13:15,850 it? 297 00:13:16,089 --> 00:13:17,129 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, exactly. 298 00:13:17,289 --> 00:13:17,610 Exactly. 299 00:13:17,769 --> 00:13:20,250 Because we're we're selling to businesses, we're selling to 300 00:13:20,250 --> 00:13:23,209 retail, e-commerce, whatever it is, businesses, but then they're 301 00:13:23,209 --> 00:13:24,569 selling to their end customers. 302 00:13:24,649 --> 00:13:26,649 So we need to be thoughtful of both elements. 303 00:13:26,730 --> 00:13:27,049 Yeah. 304 00:13:27,370 --> 00:13:29,529 SPEAKER_01: Is it difficult to make it omnichannel? 305 00:13:29,610 --> 00:13:31,449 So let's let's uh double-click on that a little bit. 306 00:13:31,529 --> 00:13:35,370 So you've got the website, but in today's world, interacting 307 00:13:35,370 --> 00:13:36,889 with a company is so fluid. 308 00:13:37,049 --> 00:13:42,490 There's social media campaigns, and who a company is to somebody 309 00:13:42,490 --> 00:13:43,449 could be anything. 310 00:13:43,769 --> 00:13:47,289 The the people, you know, a founder or the you know, people 311 00:13:47,289 --> 00:13:50,730 who are in the company who's selling, they have a neat view 312 00:13:50,730 --> 00:13:51,209 of who they are. 313 00:13:51,289 --> 00:13:52,649 They say, Well, we sell X. 314 00:13:53,209 --> 00:13:54,329 Here's our website. 315 00:13:54,409 --> 00:13:56,889 And by the way, we have some social media channels, but when 316 00:13:56,889 --> 00:14:00,089 you look at from the perspective of the buyer or the customer, 317 00:14:00,329 --> 00:14:02,889 they their first interaction with you could have been 318 00:14:02,889 --> 00:14:07,289 anything, and they have their own weird, twisty-turny, windy 319 00:14:07,289 --> 00:14:08,490 path to get to you. 320 00:14:08,809 --> 00:14:11,610 So making that coherent is a challenge. 321 00:14:11,769 --> 00:14:15,370 Uh I mean, what's what's kind of the way you guys approach that? 322 00:14:15,689 --> 00:14:16,730 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's so true. 323 00:14:16,809 --> 00:14:20,730 And and that twisty, windy path is getting more twisty and more 324 00:14:20,730 --> 00:14:23,850 windy because there's so many ways to engage with with 325 00:14:23,850 --> 00:14:24,969 products, whatever you're buying. 326 00:14:25,129 --> 00:14:27,769 Again, I like to be a little generic on this because I do 327 00:14:27,769 --> 00:14:31,449 think B2B and B2C is coming closer and closer together. 328 00:14:31,689 --> 00:14:35,689 So um, as we as we think about this journey, that journey can 329 00:14:35,689 --> 00:14:38,490 be similar if you're buying a software product or if you're 330 00:14:38,490 --> 00:14:40,490 buying a retail product, actually. 331 00:14:40,649 --> 00:14:45,610 Um, but but ultimately we need to help we help our customers or 332 00:14:45,610 --> 00:14:48,969 the the retail companies in many cases, you know, understand how 333 00:14:48,969 --> 00:14:51,610 their end customer, the consumer, wants to go through 334 00:14:51,610 --> 00:14:52,089 that journey. 335 00:14:52,250 --> 00:14:54,409 And to do that effectively, it's really data. 336 00:14:54,569 --> 00:14:56,809 You need to track data at various touch points. 337 00:14:57,049 --> 00:15:01,209 So that's the core of ultimately what we help with is if a 338 00:15:01,209 --> 00:15:05,610 customer engages on a social media post in some way, now we 339 00:15:05,610 --> 00:15:07,129 know there's that point of engagement. 340 00:15:07,289 --> 00:15:08,809 Then maybe we send them an email. 341 00:15:08,889 --> 00:15:10,089 They engage in that email. 342 00:15:10,250 --> 00:15:12,409 They may not click through it, but they open it up. 343 00:15:12,490 --> 00:15:14,329 So we know now they've looked at that email. 344 00:15:14,490 --> 00:15:18,250 Then maybe they decide to walk through the mall and sign up for 345 00:15:18,250 --> 00:15:19,370 a discount offer. 346 00:15:19,449 --> 00:15:21,449 Now we've got a little more information about them. 347 00:15:21,610 --> 00:15:23,850 And so we need to be able to triangulate all of this, first 348 00:15:23,850 --> 00:15:24,089 of all. 349 00:15:24,169 --> 00:15:26,250 We need to know that this is the same person, which is actually 350 00:15:26,250 --> 00:15:27,129 fairly complex. 351 00:15:27,289 --> 00:15:29,610 And then once we know that that's the same person, then we 352 00:15:29,610 --> 00:15:31,769 need to be able to understand their preferences on what they 353 00:15:31,769 --> 00:15:33,449 like to do and how they like to engage. 354 00:15:33,529 --> 00:15:37,289 And if they like to walk around the mall and buy things when 355 00:15:37,289 --> 00:15:39,529 discounts are available, great, we can do that. 356 00:15:39,610 --> 00:15:41,529 We can send them push notifications when they're out 357 00:15:41,610 --> 00:15:44,649 front of the store and they get a 10% coupon code to walk into 358 00:15:44,730 --> 00:15:45,610 that store right now. 359 00:15:45,769 --> 00:15:46,250 That's cool. 360 00:15:46,409 --> 00:15:46,969 People like that. 361 00:15:47,129 --> 00:15:48,969 Someone else might not be like me. 362 00:15:49,049 --> 00:15:50,089 I hate going to the mall. 363 00:15:50,169 --> 00:15:51,689 So I prefer to buy things online. 364 00:15:51,929 --> 00:15:54,969 So maybe I prefer the email offers that come through or you 365 00:15:54,969 --> 00:15:57,689 know, SMS uh messaging or whatever it might be. 366 00:15:57,769 --> 00:16:00,409 But again, understanding everyone's preferences is so key 367 00:16:00,409 --> 00:16:00,730 to it. 368 00:16:00,809 --> 00:16:03,209 And that's a lot of what we do, and that's done through a lot of 369 00:16:03,209 --> 00:16:04,409 data aggregation. 370 00:16:04,730 --> 00:16:07,129 SPEAKER_01: From a building and design perspective, you know, 371 00:16:07,209 --> 00:16:10,169 you have the idea of UX, and that's always been kind of core 372 00:16:10,169 --> 00:16:10,969 to PLG. 373 00:16:11,129 --> 00:16:15,289 Do you still, in this age of software development, still view 374 00:16:15,289 --> 00:16:19,929 UX as an important aspect of differentiation and adding value 375 00:16:19,929 --> 00:16:21,129 for your customers? 376 00:16:21,449 --> 00:16:22,809 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, it definitely is. 377 00:16:22,889 --> 00:16:26,009 It's one of the things that that actually we talk a lot about 378 00:16:26,009 --> 00:16:29,370 right now as our product, Brevo, one of the things that stands 379 00:16:29,370 --> 00:16:31,049 out for us is the UX experience. 380 00:16:31,129 --> 00:16:33,769 And it's something that we usually do differentiate on. 381 00:16:33,929 --> 00:16:38,730 The the debate for us is um very much how long will that last? 382 00:16:38,889 --> 00:16:42,329 And as we go and look at things like you know, Salesforce 383 00:16:42,409 --> 00:16:44,889 headless, headless Salesforce that they're you know, they're 384 00:16:44,889 --> 00:16:48,250 pushing, or other products out there like that, very um, you 385 00:16:48,250 --> 00:16:50,169 know, very focused on extensibility. 386 00:16:50,329 --> 00:16:53,689 I do think there's two angles on UX. 387 00:16:53,769 --> 00:16:56,730 I think the US experience UX experience is not going away. 388 00:16:56,809 --> 00:16:57,769 It's still critical. 389 00:16:58,009 --> 00:17:02,409 We are gonna see gradually more and more people focus on um 390 00:17:02,730 --> 00:17:04,170 extensibility, I believe. 391 00:17:04,329 --> 00:17:07,370 And extensibility is gonna allow for agents to engage with 392 00:17:07,370 --> 00:17:08,890 software and products in different ways. 393 00:17:09,049 --> 00:17:11,930 And again, I'll I'll think of this either from the perspective 394 00:17:11,930 --> 00:17:14,650 of who we sell to, which are businesses, or from the 395 00:17:14,650 --> 00:17:17,130 perspective of our customers when they're selling to 396 00:17:17,130 --> 00:17:17,529 consumers. 397 00:17:17,690 --> 00:17:20,809 In both cases, there will be agents buying more so than there 398 00:17:20,809 --> 00:17:22,890 are today and engaging. 399 00:17:23,130 --> 00:17:26,650 And when I think in the future, several years from now, I might 400 00:17:26,650 --> 00:17:29,529 have an agent that does all my shopping for me because I trust 401 00:17:29,529 --> 00:17:31,450 that agent and it might happen as a consumer. 402 00:17:31,690 --> 00:17:35,049 Similarly, when I'm selling to uh a software product to a 403 00:17:35,049 --> 00:17:36,650 business, they might have agents that help. 404 00:17:36,730 --> 00:17:41,050 So we have to allow for systems that um that facilitate agent 405 00:17:41,050 --> 00:17:44,009 buying, which really the UX experience I think disappears a 406 00:17:44,009 --> 00:17:44,890 lot in that case. 407 00:17:45,050 --> 00:17:46,810 But humans are still very relevant. 408 00:17:46,890 --> 00:17:48,650 We're not going away in the next few years. 409 00:17:48,810 --> 00:17:50,250 I I hope, I hope not. 410 00:17:50,330 --> 00:17:52,810 Uh famous last words. 411 00:17:53,370 --> 00:17:53,769 unknown: Yeah. 412 00:17:53,930 --> 00:17:57,130 SPEAKER_00: Uh UX experience though plays to the human nature 413 00:17:57,130 --> 00:17:57,930 of what we're doing. 414 00:17:58,090 --> 00:17:59,769 So I think it is still very relevant. 415 00:17:59,850 --> 00:18:02,330 And you know, it's hard to look beyond a few years from now. 416 00:18:02,410 --> 00:18:05,610 But in my mind, as we look kind of in in in the next, let's say, 417 00:18:05,769 --> 00:18:08,970 three to five years, I think UX is still a very relevant um 418 00:18:08,970 --> 00:18:09,610 topic. 419 00:18:09,930 --> 00:18:12,090 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I think it's I think some people are 420 00:18:12,090 --> 00:18:15,610 writing about this now where there's like the split, exactly 421 00:18:15,610 --> 00:18:17,769 what you're talking about, where it's agent buyers. 422 00:18:17,930 --> 00:18:20,650 So then there's like a different, it's not really UX, 423 00:18:20,810 --> 00:18:22,650 but it's like UX for robots. 424 00:18:22,890 --> 00:18:25,210 Like, like how do you facilitate, like if there's a 425 00:18:25,210 --> 00:18:29,370 robot whose job it is to procure items, like it it scans the 426 00:18:29,370 --> 00:18:32,090 internet maybe in a completely different way from how we do and 427 00:18:32,090 --> 00:18:33,210 then finds things. 428 00:18:33,450 --> 00:18:35,450 SPEAKER_00: So like it's almost like indexing. 429 00:18:35,529 --> 00:18:39,050 You have to index your content information properly so that 430 00:18:39,210 --> 00:18:40,810 agent can find it effectively. 431 00:18:40,890 --> 00:18:44,250 And it's something that we do even internally when we we build 432 00:18:44,250 --> 00:18:46,490 a lot of agents for for a variety of things for our 433 00:18:46,490 --> 00:18:48,250 marketing, for our sales team, and so on. 434 00:18:48,490 --> 00:18:51,690 And we actually make sure we index our data effectively. 435 00:18:51,769 --> 00:18:53,370 We use Notion for a lot of our content. 436 00:18:53,450 --> 00:18:56,090 So we have to actually index all that data in Notion to make sure 437 00:18:56,090 --> 00:18:57,930 that the agent can find it effectively. 438 00:18:58,009 --> 00:19:02,250 And I think that's really what ultimately UX kind of becomes 439 00:19:02,250 --> 00:19:05,529 over time is this this element of how do we index content 440 00:19:05,610 --> 00:19:07,930 information so that agents can find it properly. 441 00:19:08,250 --> 00:19:09,529 SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so fascinating. 442 00:19:09,690 --> 00:19:13,210 And so, okay, so when someone starts getting uh using Brevo, 443 00:19:13,529 --> 00:19:15,290 what do they, what's the experience like for them? 444 00:19:15,450 --> 00:19:17,690 Is there any kind of a diagnostic stage in the 445 00:19:17,690 --> 00:19:18,170 beginning? 446 00:19:18,330 --> 00:19:21,290 Or, you know, how do they sort of get set up and and what does 447 00:19:21,290 --> 00:19:22,810 it feel like once they're all set up? 448 00:19:23,050 --> 00:19:25,210 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so our customers will use us in a 449 00:19:25,210 --> 00:19:25,850 variety of ways. 450 00:19:25,930 --> 00:19:28,330 And now I'm talking the um the businesses who we sell to. 451 00:19:28,410 --> 00:19:30,490 Again, we're kind of talking multi-layer here. 452 00:19:30,650 --> 00:19:32,970 So the businesses who we sell to, they might decide that 453 00:19:32,970 --> 00:19:35,370 they're just gonna want to use us for email distribution. 454 00:19:35,529 --> 00:19:36,490 And that's very simple. 455 00:19:36,650 --> 00:19:38,250 They can kind of come in and start using us. 456 00:19:38,410 --> 00:19:40,009 We can be an email service provider. 457 00:19:40,170 --> 00:19:40,890 Nice and simple. 458 00:19:40,970 --> 00:19:42,570 That's the easiest use case. 459 00:19:42,730 --> 00:19:45,370 The next tier to that is omni-channel communication. 460 00:19:45,450 --> 00:19:48,570 So they want to do omni-channel, which means SMS, WhatsApp, 461 00:19:48,970 --> 00:19:50,810 email, push notifications. 462 00:19:50,970 --> 00:19:51,290 Great. 463 00:19:51,370 --> 00:19:52,090 We can do that. 464 00:19:52,330 --> 00:19:55,050 Those two configurations aren't very difficult to do. 465 00:19:55,210 --> 00:19:56,810 They can get up and running very quickly. 466 00:19:56,970 --> 00:19:59,769 We can help them kind of log in, set up if they want to migrate 467 00:19:59,769 --> 00:20:00,490 their database in. 468 00:20:00,570 --> 00:20:02,570 They might, you know, of course, they're probably going to want 469 00:20:02,570 --> 00:20:02,890 to do that. 470 00:20:03,050 --> 00:20:04,810 We'll help them with that data migration. 471 00:20:04,970 --> 00:20:07,690 But um, it's fairly simple to get up and running in those 472 00:20:07,690 --> 00:20:08,009 cases. 473 00:20:08,090 --> 00:20:12,170 They'll build out certain um uh workflows and get up and 474 00:20:12,170 --> 00:20:12,410 running. 475 00:20:12,490 --> 00:20:14,570 And those can be you know built on their own, or they can 476 00:20:14,570 --> 00:20:17,130 leverage agents to help them kind of build those AI agents 477 00:20:17,130 --> 00:20:18,250 through our MCP. 478 00:20:18,410 --> 00:20:21,290 Um, now the third tier to this is much more sophisticated. 479 00:20:21,450 --> 00:20:24,570 Whereas if they say, okay, I want to use uh Brevo for 480 00:20:24,570 --> 00:20:28,570 omni-channel communication and I want to use it for a full-blown 481 00:20:28,570 --> 00:20:31,930 CDP, I want to use it for my loyalty capabilities, I want to 482 00:20:31,930 --> 00:20:34,170 use a wallet, um, the wallet capabilities. 483 00:20:34,330 --> 00:20:36,090 So now you're getting into the full system. 484 00:20:36,330 --> 00:20:39,370 And this usually requires integrations with third-party 485 00:20:39,370 --> 00:20:40,730 apps and tools that they already have. 486 00:20:40,890 --> 00:20:44,250 So it can be a little bit more sophisticated of a solution, but 487 00:20:44,250 --> 00:20:46,490 it takes a little longer to get that set up as well. 488 00:20:46,650 --> 00:20:50,650 And anything from how we uh set up the CDP, leveraging data that 489 00:20:50,650 --> 00:20:52,570 they already have or tools that they already have, we need to 490 00:20:52,570 --> 00:20:53,850 make sure the integrations are there. 491 00:20:54,009 --> 00:20:56,730 Again, if they're using loyalty, they might already have some 492 00:20:56,730 --> 00:20:59,850 loyalty tools or they might ever have a point of sale solution 493 00:20:59,850 --> 00:21:00,970 that we want to integrate with. 494 00:21:01,130 --> 00:21:02,890 So there are some integrations in that case. 495 00:21:02,970 --> 00:21:03,769 So it depends. 496 00:21:03,930 --> 00:21:07,610 It's a it's a longer answer than you expected, but it depends a 497 00:21:07,610 --> 00:21:09,930 little bit on the flavor of what they want to from us. 498 00:21:10,410 --> 00:21:10,730 SPEAKER_01: Gotcha. 499 00:21:10,890 --> 00:21:13,370 And so, I mean, kind of like HubSpot and some of the other 500 00:21:13,370 --> 00:21:15,370 ones, it's just a you know, a broad tool. 501 00:21:15,610 --> 00:21:19,450 It's a lot of capability and and just the CRMs, they've been 502 00:21:19,450 --> 00:21:21,930 around for so long, they've developed in so many ways. 503 00:21:22,090 --> 00:21:25,290 You you kind of have to build a giant platform if you're in that 504 00:21:25,290 --> 00:21:25,690 space. 505 00:21:26,090 --> 00:21:26,410 SPEAKER_00: Exactly. 506 00:21:26,650 --> 00:21:26,970 Exactly. 507 00:21:27,130 --> 00:21:29,769 You have to give the flexibility for people who want who want 508 00:21:29,769 --> 00:21:30,730 that flexibility. 509 00:21:30,970 --> 00:21:31,210 SPEAKER_01: Right. 510 00:21:31,290 --> 00:21:34,970 And then so what do you say to folks who are thinking about, 511 00:21:35,050 --> 00:21:37,850 you know, we're in an age where I think a lot of people, when 512 00:21:37,850 --> 00:21:40,810 they look at SaaS products that they could potentially have, 513 00:21:40,970 --> 00:21:44,410 they're we're now thinking, okay, should I get a SAS product 514 00:21:44,490 --> 00:21:47,450 or should I just try to vibe something up this weekend and 515 00:21:47,450 --> 00:21:51,370 with a few MD files and a few hours talking to Claude, I guess 516 00:21:51,690 --> 00:21:51,930 something. 517 00:21:52,250 --> 00:21:54,970 So what what would you what would you say to someone who's 518 00:21:54,970 --> 00:21:58,170 kind of on the fence about that in thinking about getting Brevo? 519 00:21:58,490 --> 00:22:02,810 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I think um there's a lot of opportunity to 520 00:22:02,810 --> 00:22:03,690 vibe code apps. 521 00:22:03,850 --> 00:22:07,529 Apps are going to be extremely valuable to solve for unique use 522 00:22:07,529 --> 00:22:07,930 cases. 523 00:22:08,090 --> 00:22:12,410 The thing that, unless if you want to be a CRM or a customer 524 00:22:12,410 --> 00:22:16,410 platform uh or really a system of record, that's your goal as a 525 00:22:16,410 --> 00:22:16,890 business. 526 00:22:17,130 --> 00:22:19,850 Then if you're not, if that's not part of your business goals, 527 00:22:19,930 --> 00:22:22,810 I don't think it's a good idea to build a product yourself 528 00:22:22,890 --> 00:22:24,730 that's a system of record product. 529 00:22:24,970 --> 00:22:28,250 And you can build apps that sit around a system of record to 530 00:22:28,250 --> 00:22:31,130 help ensure that system is working as effectively as 531 00:22:31,130 --> 00:22:33,690 possible, but you still need Something that's going to be 532 00:22:33,690 --> 00:22:35,690 that system of record and that'll help with the 533 00:22:35,690 --> 00:22:38,009 orchestration layer of all this data and content. 534 00:22:38,170 --> 00:22:39,930 But then your apps can sit outside of that. 535 00:22:40,009 --> 00:22:42,890 So I think it's extremely important to buy a system of 536 00:22:42,890 --> 00:22:45,130 record tool that has extensibility. 537 00:22:45,210 --> 00:22:46,890 So you can connect to a variety of apps. 538 00:22:46,970 --> 00:22:49,450 So you can vibe code on the weekend some new app that you 539 00:22:49,450 --> 00:22:53,130 want to set up and run and it and it works very quickly. 540 00:22:53,290 --> 00:22:55,850 But I wouldn't recommend it unless if your business truly 541 00:22:55,850 --> 00:22:59,450 is, your business plan truly is to be a system of record or CRM 542 00:22:59,450 --> 00:23:00,090 type of product. 543 00:23:00,330 --> 00:23:00,490 SPEAKER_01: Right. 544 00:23:00,570 --> 00:23:03,769 It's kind of that whole stick to your core competency when you're 545 00:23:03,769 --> 00:23:04,890 uh really building anything. 546 00:23:05,050 --> 00:23:08,250 Ladies and gentlemen, we're speaking with Channing Ferrer of 547 00:23:08,250 --> 00:23:10,490 Brevo, and it's brevo.com. 548 00:23:10,570 --> 00:23:13,050 I'm on the website right now, looks like a beautiful product. 549 00:23:13,210 --> 00:23:15,050 Um, so hopefully people check that out. 550 00:23:15,130 --> 00:23:17,769 What do people have to look forward to from just sort of 551 00:23:17,769 --> 00:23:19,690 near-term roadmap items from Brevo? 552 00:23:19,930 --> 00:23:20,490 SPEAKER_00: Yeah, sure. 553 00:23:20,650 --> 00:23:23,370 I'll I'll um maybe I'll speak a little bit for a minute about 554 00:23:23,370 --> 00:23:25,370 some of the uh AI stuff that we're doing. 555 00:23:25,450 --> 00:23:27,290 So that's always top of mind for everyone. 556 00:23:27,450 --> 00:23:29,930 Um, you know, I was just actually working on a slide deck 557 00:23:29,930 --> 00:23:31,850 right before this for a customer meeting coming up. 558 00:23:32,009 --> 00:23:34,570 And one of the things that uh I'll answer your question in a 559 00:23:34,570 --> 00:23:36,810 moment, but one of the things that I was working on is where 560 00:23:36,810 --> 00:23:39,370 are we going when I think two or three years from now, not even 561 00:23:39,370 --> 00:23:39,690 just today. 562 00:23:39,769 --> 00:23:41,690 So we've got our list of features that are coming out, 563 00:23:41,769 --> 00:23:43,610 you know, here in Q2 and beyond. 564 00:23:43,690 --> 00:23:45,930 Um, but I think one of the things that we've really spent a 565 00:23:45,930 --> 00:23:47,930 lot of time thinking about and looking at is how do you create 566 00:23:47,930 --> 00:23:50,890 that truly agentic experience where if you want to, not 567 00:23:50,890 --> 00:23:53,210 everyone's ready for that today, but I think in the future state, 568 00:23:53,290 --> 00:23:56,570 we'll see a lot more interest in the idea of saying, hey, I want 569 00:23:56,570 --> 00:23:59,370 to run a um win back campaign. 570 00:23:59,529 --> 00:24:01,130 Here's$10,000. 571 00:24:01,690 --> 00:24:03,290 Can you go figure it out for me, bro? 572 00:24:03,769 --> 00:24:04,570 And they would. 573 00:24:04,650 --> 00:24:06,570 And it comes back to you saying, all right, here's what we're 574 00:24:06,570 --> 00:24:06,810 gonna do. 575 00:24:06,890 --> 00:24:09,130 We're gonna do hyper-personalized targeting to 576 00:24:09,130 --> 00:24:11,529 these customers that left us over the past 12 months. 577 00:24:11,769 --> 00:24:14,170 And, you know, three weeks later, you kind of get your 578 00:24:14,330 --> 00:24:14,970 results from it. 579 00:24:15,050 --> 00:24:17,290 So I think that's the future state opportunity. 580 00:24:17,450 --> 00:24:20,490 We want to, of course, bridge where we are today to that sort 581 00:24:20,490 --> 00:24:21,450 of a scenario. 582 00:24:21,610 --> 00:24:24,170 Um, the first thing, which we were just talking about, is 583 00:24:24,170 --> 00:24:26,490 extensibility, you know, fully extensible product. 584 00:24:26,570 --> 00:24:27,850 We have APIs already in place. 585 00:24:27,930 --> 00:24:31,610 We have our NCP MCP servers out there, but we do want to make 586 00:24:31,610 --> 00:24:33,130 sure that we're fully extensible. 587 00:24:33,290 --> 00:24:36,410 We have a marketplace that we're launching as well with pre-built 588 00:24:36,410 --> 00:24:39,050 integrations, but also the ability for people to build 589 00:24:39,050 --> 00:24:42,170 their own integrations either outside of Brevo or inside of 590 00:24:42,170 --> 00:24:42,570 Brevo. 591 00:24:42,970 --> 00:24:45,130 So you can build kind of custom features within Brevo. 592 00:24:45,610 --> 00:24:48,250 Um, we have further data management tools. 593 00:24:48,410 --> 00:24:51,290 Again, we are a CDP, so we're extending kind of what we do on 594 00:24:51,290 --> 00:24:52,490 the CDP side. 595 00:24:52,730 --> 00:24:58,250 Our uh AI tool we call Aura is um fairly robust today, but 596 00:24:58,250 --> 00:25:00,570 again, building workflows that kind of sync between, I'm 597 00:25:00,570 --> 00:25:03,610 keeping it high level here, but sync between different features 598 00:25:03,610 --> 00:25:04,890 within within Brevo. 599 00:25:04,970 --> 00:25:07,450 Our smart loyalty capabilities, I think, are really cool 600 00:25:07,610 --> 00:25:08,009 actually. 601 00:25:08,090 --> 00:25:11,930 Um, what we allow for is just not a simple loyalty solution, 602 00:25:12,009 --> 00:25:16,410 but it allows to um really bridge the basic loyalty point 603 00:25:16,650 --> 00:25:19,050 system with the idea of creating advocates. 604 00:25:19,210 --> 00:25:22,330 And what you can do is have an advocate who's a speaker on your 605 00:25:22,330 --> 00:25:26,330 behalf, and they earn credits in a sense to be that sort of uh uh 606 00:25:26,330 --> 00:25:26,890 an advocate. 607 00:25:26,970 --> 00:25:30,170 That can be as simple as posting an Instagram you know, post or 608 00:25:30,170 --> 00:25:31,610 something to earn those credits. 609 00:25:31,690 --> 00:25:34,490 So, again, some interesting things there that all tie back 610 00:25:34,490 --> 00:25:38,170 into a lot of retail-oriented capabilities, but uh tie back 611 00:25:38,170 --> 00:25:39,850 into our core competencies. 612 00:25:40,170 --> 00:25:40,730 SPEAKER_01: That's awesome. 613 00:25:40,890 --> 00:25:43,769 And I love that you had the opportunity just then to take 614 00:25:43,769 --> 00:25:46,810 the work you've been working on with your deck and to be able to 615 00:25:47,050 --> 00:25:50,490 top of mind flow all that fresh information for us. 616 00:25:51,290 --> 00:25:51,850 Great stuff. 617 00:25:51,930 --> 00:25:55,050 So, brevo.com, ladies and gentlemen, uh please check that 618 00:25:55,050 --> 00:25:55,210 out. 619 00:25:55,290 --> 00:25:57,610 And uh Channing, thanks for being with us today. 620 00:25:57,769 --> 00:25:58,170 SPEAKER_00: Definitely. 621 00:25:58,250 --> 00:25:59,130 Thomas, my pleasure. 622 00:25:59,290 --> 00:25:59,850 Thanks for the time.